Disney Afternoon Discussion Thread

All topics relating to Disney-branded content.
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Goliath
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Post by Goliath »

@ Avaitor:

I've read your Duck Tales-article and I spotted some points I don't agree with. I always thought Fenton had a lot of characteristics that were taken straight from Donald Duck, the way Carl Barks portrayed him. The clumsy attempts at social climbing that Fenton often engages in, is a big part of Barks' short Donald Duck stories. What's funny is that this, in turn, was based on Barks' own life, who held dozens of different jobs before settling on being a comics artist.

Also, I don't agree that 'Back to the Klondike' was a good Barks-adaptation. Out of curiosity: have you ever read the comic? If not, I highly recommend it. You can read it here:
http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... _OS_456-02

You will notice how different the stories are, in content, in the characterization of Scrooge and most of all in the structure of the story. Barks' revelation of Scrooge's soft side is much more subtle and open to multiple interpretations, while the tv episodes turns him into a romantic sap. Not my cup of tea.

It's not entirely true that Scrooge never stooped to thieving and cheating to make a profit (like Glomgold). In the Barks-story 'Voodoo Hoodoo' (1949), Scrooge brags to Donald and his nephews about the time when he "hired a mob of thugs and chased the tribe [living on a plot of land he wanted to own] into the jungle!"
http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... -02&s=date

You write that Magica DeSpell believe Scrooge's lucky dime is magical, but that's only partially true. She believes that coins that have been touched many times by rich, powerful people contain a kind of energy which, if she melts those coins all together, will form an amulet which will give her King Midas' "Golden touch" (everything he touched turned into gold). If you want to read how she explains it herself, you can read it herë:
http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... W_US_36-01

Okay, that was the comic fan/Barks-fan in me. But I do care about complete accuracy. However, I agreed with all the other things you said about the show. And I thought the article was very well written, much better than your first attempt (Gummi Bears). It's a pleasent, smooth reading.
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Post by Super Aurora »

Again no one answered this question for me but what animal is the dude on far left is? been long time since I've seen TalesSpin:

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Post by slave2moonlight »

His name is Wildcat, but I always assumed him to be a lion.
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Post by Avaitor »

Goliath wrote: I always thought Fenton had a lot of characteristics that were taken straight from Donald Duck, the way Carl Barks portrayed him. The clumsy attempts at social climbing that Fenton often engages in, is a big part of Barks' short Donald Duck stories. What's funny is that this, in turn, was based on Barks' own life, who held dozens of different jobs before settling on being a comics artist.
Fenton was basically the show's replacement for Donald when he joined the show, I won't deny that, but I like him for his own character. He's much wackier than Donald, which reflects the way the show was changing at that point, and has some great bits of animation when he's on screen. For example, in one scene of "Super DuckTales" in which Fenton is looking through a pair of binocluars, which grow the more they appear on screen. It's very clever and cartoony, which makes it a great piece of work.

I suppose I mostly like him out of nostalgia, as he was one of my favorite characters a kid, but I still enjoy him all the same.
Goliath wrote:Also, I don't agree that 'Back to the Klondike' was a good Barks-adaptation. Out of curiosity: have you ever read the comic? If not, I highly recommend it. You can read it here:
http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... _OS_456-02

You will notice how different the stories are, in content, in the characterization of Scrooge and most of all in the structure of the story. Barks' revelation of Scrooge's soft side is much more subtle and open to multiple interpretations, while the tv episodes turns him into a romantic sap. Not my cup of tea.
I've read it before, like many of Bark's most reverred stories. The original is definitely the best, but I don't mind the changes the DuckTales version did. Again, blame it to nostalgia, but I still think that the TV version is sweet in it's own regard, even if it's not as subtle as the original.
Goliath wrote:It's not entirely true that Scrooge never stooped to thieving and cheating to make a profit (like Glomgold). In the Barks-story 'Voodoo Hoodoo' (1949), Scrooge brags to Donald and his nephews about the time when he "hired a mob of thugs and chased the tribe [living on a plot of land he wanted to own] into the jungle!"
http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... -02&s=date
This story I'll have to admit to not being as familiar with. I mainly meant that over the years, Scrooge has aquired a rich understanding of how the economic system works, and somewhere along the way has learned that stooping down to Glomgold or the Beagle Boy's levels isn't the right way to earn money. I suppose he has cheated before, but there's no way that he would do something like that now.

It's great to find a fan of Scrooge's life outside of DuckTales, as I don't know too many huge Barks fans myself. I'll admit that my knowledge of Barks work isn't as fresh as it used to be, but I respect that his comics and DuckTales are two different entities, and I love them both.

Can I ask you, what do you think of the Beagle Boys in the show? Do you mind that each of them have separate personalities and their own names? I've read that some hardcore Barks fans prefer that their original characters were exact copies of each other, to reflect the banality of the prison system? I like how Bigtime, Burger, and the gang are their own people myself, but since you're big on consistency, what do you think?

Sorry if my responses seem lazy, but I'm very tired as of right now, and swamped with work not related to the blog. I wanted to respond to you as soon as I could, which is why I did right now.
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Post by Goliath »

@ Avaitor:

Your responses don't seem lazy at all. There's no need to hurry to answer me. That's the nice thing about a forum: you can take all the time you want to give a thoughtful response.

My response wasn't meant as a criticism of your article, which I enjoyed. Just the fact that you mentioned Barks' comics as the inspiration for Duck Tales is a big plus to me. Most Americans I know aren't familiar with his work. I grew up with it, and comic books with his stories are still relatively easy to come by in Holland. I've understood that's much harder in the US, which is a shame. On the site I linked to a couple of times, you can read them all. (It's amazing this is possible; I feel too often we take these kind of things for granted.)

I just thought those little facts would be a nice addition to the information given by you. And maybe I can sparkle some interest in Barks among the members of this forum (who knows?).

I'm not so big on continuity, actually. One reason why I don't like Don Rosa's work very much (anymore), is because his obsessive quest to cram all his stories (and, in his mind, Barks' stories) in own big continuity-based framework. But Barks never cared about continuity. With so many artists working on the same characters as the Disney Ducks, this is impossible. Many different artists have very different ideas about who Donald and Scrooge *are* and how their world should look. Duck Tales is just one more interpretation.

What I do have a problem with, is unneccesary changes in Barks' stories. Like how they changed the wolf-figure Chisel McSue into a fox, and the horseradish in marbles in "Down and out in Duckburg", the adaptation of 'the horseradish story', in which Scrooge has to find a cargo of horseradish that his ancestor lost at sea, or else he will have to give his whole fortune to the wolf/fox-figure:

http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... _OS_495-02

In the comic, the quest to find the horseradish is portrayed as a race against the clock: there is very limited time and Scrooge and his nephews have to to search a whole lot of ocean before they find the sunken ship. When they get into a storm and call for help via the radio, Chisel McSue also hears this and he decides to go after the Ducks. Due to circumstances, at one point in the story, Scrooge is forced to choose between rescuing Chisel or the horseradish (saving the life of his enemy or losing his whole fortune). And there's an important moment of doubt there. The Duck Tales episode has thrown all that out in favor for some slapstick about how the fox changes Scrooge's mansion and some melodrama about how the Ducks live in poverty. I don't understand why changed a winning formula, but like I said, it's just one interpretation.

The individual Beagle Boys fit in well in that interpretation, although I would have preferred it if they would have looked a little more like Barks' Beagle Boys (the Duck Tales versions have rather big noses, compared to Barks'). I've never heard Barks made them all look alike to stress the banality of the prison system, but that's certainly a good explanation that would fit right in with Barks' work. In one story, he portrayed the prison as a place where criminals could study and obtain all kinds of degrees. This should be aimed at resocializing, but as soon as the Beagle Boys get out, they use this knowledge to rob Scrooge:

http://disneycomics.free.fr/Ducks/Barks ... -02&s=date
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Post by Avaitor »

I'm not 100% positive if that is what Barks was aiming for when he made the Beagles relatively undistinguishable, but I've read elsewhere that this might have been a reason he did that.

Anyway, my next article is up if you guys are interested. If you want to discuss any of the series in particular, you're more than welcome to, but as for now, the one I'm focusing my attention on is Darkwing Duck.

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Post by Goliath »

Back to TaleSpin, which I had not yet covered. I think you, Avaitor, hit the nail right on the head with this little part of your article:
How many other kids shows can you think of that represent a lost era of 30’s lore, lovingly crafted like a screwball comedy at air from the time frame, with enough modern sensibilities to make the show feel as fresh as anything?
That is definitly *the* reason why the show was such a succes, and why I still love it so much. It really has that feeling. I found it hard to describe it, but you did it. "A screwball comedy" is certainly the way to describe Baloo and Rebecca's relationship. I also liked the relationship between Baloo and Kit, with Baloo acting as a father figure to the boy. In fact Baloo, Kit, Rebecca and Molly form a family without actually being related. You don't see this kind of relations in other Disney shows (except maybe between Drake Mallard and Gosalyn). It's deeper and more meaningful a show than most.
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Post by Avaitor »

Goliath wrote:Back to TaleSpin, which I had not yet covered. I think you, Avaitor, hit the nail right on the head with this little part of your article:
How many other kids shows can you think of that represent a lost era of 30’s lore, lovingly crafted like a screwball comedy at air from the time frame, with enough modern sensibilities to make the show feel as fresh as anything?
That is definitly *the* reason why the show was such a succes, and why I still love it so much. It really has that feeling. I found it hard to describe it, but you did it. "A screwball comedy" is certainly the way to describe Baloo and Rebecca's relationship. I also liked the relationship between Baloo and Kit, with Baloo acting as a father figure to the boy. In fact Baloo, Kit, Rebecca and Molly form a family without actually being related. You don't see this kind of relations in other Disney shows (except maybe between Drake Mallard and Gosalyn). It's deeper and more meaningful a show than most.
Heh, thanks. Like I said in the review, I really appreciate TaleSpin more now than I did as a kid. Another thing I love about the show is the variety of plots. I like how one episode can be a very emotional episode involving Rebecca being wooed by a ghost who attempts to take her spirit away while the next can be a goofy one where Baloo and Kit try really hard to mail Rebecca's letter which will make her $100,000 richer.

Sorry I didn't mention these earlier, but I finished my next two retrospectives, Darkwing Duck and Goof Troop, already. I'd suggest that you guys talk about Bonkers now, but hey, you guys can talk about whatever. I like that this thread is getting attention at all.
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Post by Goliath »

I'm surprised this thread sinks to the second page as soon as I'm not on UD for a day. How can it be that 100 people can discuss Tangled every day, while we know absolutely *nothing* new about it, and all we can do is speculate... yet this topic is ignored? :?

So we (you and I; the rest is still debating Tangled's name-change) were just discussing Darkwing Duck.

I have very fond memories of the show, and it was my absolute favorite as a kid. As an adult, I still can enjoy it a lot, because there is so much in that show that really aims at adults (parodies, satire, self-referential gags, etc.). I just think the premise is so great: you have a superhero who is more concerned with his ego and his fame than solving crimes. He often gets so absorbed with his own concerns that he fails to adequately react to the threat of the villains. The villains are of course a huge part of the appeal of the show, because they are all so wonderfully wacky, obviously heavily inspired by the Batman-comics/films. There's a wide variety of them which helps to keep the show interesting. Last but not least, there's the relationship between Drake Mallard and his daughter. It was kind of heavy to see this on a kids' show: an orphan who gets adopted and the struggles Drake has with Gosalyn. But you can really tell they love each other.

However, my appreciation of the show got a huge dent when I discovered all the episoed that never aired in The Netherlands. As it turns out, I have grown up on a thin diet of episodes. But after seeing the missing ones on YouTube, I can conclude I grew up on the best of them. And before you say "nostalgia!", let me say this: some of those episodes I didn't see before, I liked them best. Like 'Life, the Negaverse and Everything'. I saw that one only last year and regard it one of the best episodes. And some of the episodes I saw as a kid, I don't like anymore. Take 'Twin Beaks', which starts as a brilliant parody on my favorite show Twin Peaks, but ends disappointingly with a nonse-plot about space invaders.

So, looking back, I'd say this show needed more balance. There's a lot of bad among the good. There are too many episodes which focus almost entirely on slapstick, and there's *too* much self-referential plots. Like the episode in which Darkwing and Megavolt land in 'our' world. I hated the idea that Darkwing only exists in a 'cartoon land', seperate from ours. That was not how the show was designed up to that point. And taking into account that it shared a universe with Duck tales (through Launchpad and Gizmoduck), that would mean *all* Ducks exist only in a cartoon world, and that's definitly not how they have always been interpretated.

Still, I think this was one of Disney's best shows, if not for one of the best theme songs. The phrase "Laten we lekker link gaan doen" ("Let's get dangerous") is an institution in The Netherlands. Everybody knows it and instantly recognizes it.

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/OZ2R6 ... ram><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube-nocookie.com/v/OZ2R6 ... en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>
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Post by Avaitor »

That is one awesome opener.

I have to agree that DW isn't completely consistent; when I bought volume 1, I was surprised at how many weak episodes there were as well as the good stuff. As it gets along, the show becomes a bit stronger, but it still doesn't have the best track record.

I guess that's what makes it like a comic book. Between the handful of great storylines, you get a few stinkers that go on for too long.
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Post by slave2moonlight »

Like several post DuckTales/TaleSpin/Rescue Rangers Disney Afternoon shows, Darkwing was one of those that had episodes made for weekday syndication and much higher quality episodes made for Saturday morning airing (the difference is especially noticeable on shows like Aladdin though). Anyway, I very much loved this show. I'll always remember its Disney Channel premiere (as a lot of the Disney animated TV shows first ran on Disney Channel, like TaleSpin, Rescue Rangers, and Pooh), because it was on an Easter Sunday. I believe it was a Moliarty episode. Loved the way that it incorporated elements from DuckTales and yet was mainly original Disney characters, plus had some great humor too. I'm really psyched that apparently Darkwing will be returning to comics soon from Boom comics (the folks doing all the new Disney stuff, mostly Muppets and PIXAR but also new Scrooge and Mickey and Donald stuff too that mixes American and European aspects into new concepts like wizard and superhero stories..., plus they've started doing new DuckTales stuff that includes Donald with the DuckTales gang!). I've been trying to catch up with the collections from Boom of their new Disney stuff, and I'm getting there, but even the number of collections has become overwhelming. They're really turning stuff out fast! I'm also psyched to eventually get that Darkwing sculpture by Electric Tiki. They've been covering the Disney Afternoon a little at a time, and I hope they keep going (and that I'm able to eventually get them all off Ebay, as I'm unemployed right now).

Incidentally, I haven't posted because I was out of town for quite a while.
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Post by Avaitor »

Yesterday, I picked up the first issue of Boom's DuckTales comic, which is really just Uncle Scrooge in DuckTales, but I'm glad to have it.

From what I understand, both of these are old DT comics reissued here, which is fine by me. Can't tell where the first story is from, but the second comes from Disney Adventures, probably in the 1990-1992 range.

The first has Donald for some reason, I'm assuming off of duty from the Navy, and have them go on a pretty standard adventure from the show. It's good stuff for what it is. The writing is pretty decent, since they seem to have a grasp of the characters. Not that many laugh out loud moments, but there are a couple of chuckles in the dialogue. I like how Launchpad is in character rather than acting like a second Donald in it, which makes sense since Donald is also in it, and the line between the two is set well. Laucnhpad does kind of feel shoehorned in though. It kind of feels like that he was added so the gang can get a ride to the mountain and, more importantly, that they can market it as a DuckTales story, but I like him all the same.

The artwork is also solid. It looks like basic Rosa, which is a good compliment. If anything, Scrooge's reactions kind of look blank, like a creepy smile will be added in for no reason or he'll have this strange grin that looks off-model.

The second isn't as good, at least to me. Storywise, it's basically a retread of "New Gizmo Kids on the Block", but instead of the kids finding Gizmoduck's suit, they build their own from Gyro's reject pile and Webby takes it for the whole story instead of Huey having it at first. I like it when Gizmoduck gets into action, especially Burger's(I think it was Burger, at least) delayed response. The artwork is kind of bland, like a lot of DA stories that I read recently, but the characters look fine, at least.

This is an okay collection, but Darkwing's comic is where it's going to be at. If you haven't read these stories before and want to see new DT, this is as close as you're going to get. I'm buying any Uncle Scrooge comic with DT stories in them to make sure that we get more of these stories.
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Post by Goliath »

Avaitor wrote:The first has Donald for some reason, I'm assuming off of duty from the Navy, and have them go on a pretty standard adventure from the show. [...] Laucnhpad does kind of feel shoehorned in though. It kind of feels like that he was added so the gang can get a ride to the mountain and, more importantly, that they can market it as a DuckTales story, but I like him all the same.
Is it possible you're talking about this story:
http://coa.inducks.org/story.php?c=D+94039

It has Daisy, Grandma Duck and Gus Goose in it. It's done by Vicar, whose style is very different from Rosa.

I'm trying to keep this thread alive virtually on my own, despite the early enthusiasm of other members which it seems has died off. On to Goof Troop now, where I last time left of.

I can be very short about it: I liked it as a kid, but now that I've grown up, I don't understand why I ever did. Unlike Chip 'N Dale Rescue Rangers, which I don't enjoy nearly as much as an adult, but which I can still watch and see why it's a great kids show. But Goof Troop... I don't know... Maybe because it's the first departure from the adventure-styled earlier shows? Because of the mediocre animation? I think mostly, it's the lack of storylines and gags that would have made it appealing to adults as well. The antics of Goofy are unwatchable as an adult, even though everybody loves the classic Goofy short cartoons. This series is just too much aimed at children only.

To continue the tradition, Goof Troop in Dutch:

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Post by Avaitor »

Goliath wrote: Is it possible you're talking about this story:
http://coa.inducks.org/story.php?c=D+94039

It has Daisy, Grandma Duck and Gus Goose in it. It's done by Vicar, whose style is very different from Rosa.
Nope, this one is entitled "The Everlasting Coal", and doesn't have any comic regulars who don't reguarly show up in DT other than Donald. Duckworth and Miss Beakley also appear in a few panel,s ubt that's not really worth mentioning.

This was written by Paul Halas & Tom Anderson, and was drawn by Xavier Vives Mateu. I don't really recognize these names to be completely honest.
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Post by slave2moonlight »

Avaitor wrote:This was written by Paul Halas & Tom Anderson, and was drawn by Xavier Vives Mateu. I don't really recognize these names to be completely honest.
I honestly suspect that at least the first one is an all new story. Boom has MOSTLY been doing new stuff lately, trying to update the characters by making them superhero teams, secret agents, wizards, and with Scrooge trying to take it back to the popular DuckTales scenario I guess. But, what I like is how they are trying to make the worlds as big as they can now. For example, Sid from Toy Story becomes a villain in a Monsters, Inc. story, characters better known in Europe are being incorporated into the Mickey/Donald/Goofy/Scrooge stuff (they even mentioned St. Canard from Darkwing Duck and did a joke about Rescue Rangers), and DuckTales includes Donald (I took it to mean that he was out of the Navy already in the new Scrooge comic, though I only flipped through it, as I'm waiting for the collections rather than individual issues). Though, I guess it COULD be from Disney Adventures, since I didn't get the book in its later years (too little emphasis on comics by then, cheaper materials, and I got annoyed at having a subscription because it was sent with no protection and the address label right across the cover, ruining it as a collectible; though I wish I'd kept getting it since I here the few comics it had did expand to some interesting subjects, like an updated Dexter Riley).
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Post by Avaitor »

It probably is a newer story. This was a little too good to be a Disney Adventures story, which usually don't rank above decent. I'm not familiar with Scrooge's current writers, so these could be them for all I know.

New Dexter Riley stories, you say? I need to look for those.
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Post by Goliath »

Avaitor wrote:Nope, this one is entitled "The Everlasting Coal", and doesn't have any comic regulars who don't reguarly show up in DT other than Donald. Duckworth and Miss Beakley also appear in a few panel,s ubt that's not really worth mentioning.

This was written by Paul Halas & Tom Anderson, and was drawn by Xavier Vives Mateu. I don't really recognize these names to be completely honest.
Heh... familiar names to me. It must be this story:
http://coa.inducks.org/story.php?c=D+89255

It was first published in 1991 in Europe, in 2010 published in the US. It has never been published in The Netherlands. Which is strange, because for the longest time we had a bi-monthly 'Duck Tales' magazine (more like a comic book) which, at the end of its run, contained fewer and fewer 'Duck Tales' stories, and more other Disney Afternoon-comics and old Mickey Mouse newspaper comics. I thought they had run out of 'Duck Tales' comics. And now I see this. The artwork looks attractive. Better than Xavi's Mickey Mouse work.
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Post by slave2moonlight »

Goliath wrote:
Avaitor wrote:Nope, this one is entitled "The Everlasting Coal", and doesn't have any comic regulars who don't reguarly show up in DT other than Donald. Duckworth and Miss Beakley also appear in a few panel,s ubt that's not really worth mentioning.

This was written by Paul Halas & Tom Anderson, and was drawn by Xavier Vives Mateu. I don't really recognize these names to be completely honest.
Heh... familiar names to me. It must be this story:
http://coa.inducks.org/story.php?c=D+89255

It was first published in 1991 in Europe, in 2010 published in the US. It has never been published in The Netherlands. Which is strange, because for the longest time we had a bi-monthly 'Duck Tales' magazine (more like a comic book) which, at the end of its run, contained fewer and fewer 'Duck Tales' stories, and more other Disney Afternoon-comics and old Mickey Mouse newspaper comics. I thought they had run out of 'Duck Tales' comics. And now I see this. The artwork looks attractive. Better than Xavi's Mickey Mouse work.
Yeah, that IS it! Interesting. I wonder how much of Boom's material is European reprint stuff.
Avaitor wrote: New Dexter Riley stories, you say? I need to look for those.
Yeah, I haven't even seen them myself, but I've heard a lot about them from others.

Anyway, I forgot to talk about Goof Troop. Actually, it's been a long time since I've seen any of it, aside from the few episodes on the single disc release here in the U.S., and I don't even remember which episodes were on that one because I haven't watched it in a while. However, looking back, I loved the show a lot back when it was on, but yeah, much of the time the visuals were disappointing. Hard to comment on the writing quality without watching it fresh. I got a lot of enjoyment out of it when it was on, and I was in my later High School years at the time. But, of course, how much I liked it really depended on the episodes. Yeah, it was a departure from adventure stories, but it was perfect for Goofy. Very clever doing a show about him being a single dad, though we knew he worked well in that role due to the theatrical shorts in which he had a son and the mother was hardly seen (literally). Brining Pete in as the bad neighbor, probably something else inspired by theatrical shorts with him and Donald, also worked great, and the original characters were fantastic, like Max and Pete's entire family. I had a hard time getting over the fact that it erased the original Goofy Jr. though, and I still want to know who Max's mother was (or Goofy Jr. for that matter). Anyone have any ideas? I never cared for the matching of Goofy with Clarabelle, whom I always saw as a match for Horace. I like the character of Sylvia for Goofy now, but I would love to know who Max's mother was, if only for the sake of my fan-comic:

Image
At the moment, I guess I'll have to put Sylvia in the role.
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Post by Avaitor »

slave2moonlight wrote: Yeah, that IS it! Interesting. I wonder how much of Boom's material is European reprint stuff.
Actually, reading an article about DW's ocmic, pretty much all of the main Disney character's stories in Boom are European imports. Pixar, Muppets, and Darkwing's stories are all new with fresh writers, but Mickey, Donlad, Goofy, and Scrooge's titles are mainly reprints.
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Post by slave2moonlight »

Avaitor wrote:
slave2moonlight wrote: Yeah, that IS it! Interesting. I wonder how much of Boom's material is European reprint stuff.
Actually, reading an article about DW's ocmic, pretty much all of the main Disney character's stories in Boom are European imports. Pixar, Muppets, and Darkwing's stories are all new with fresh writers, but Mickey, Donlad, Goofy, and Scrooge's titles are mainly reprints.
You mean the Wizards storyline and the Superhero storyline are also imports? And the Double Duck storyline as well?
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