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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 9:28 am 
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Marce82 wrote:
I agree with some of the comments: it doesn't put Disney in a bad light, but one has to admit it doesn't portray the company as the most desirable place to work at; it doesn't make working for them (as an outsider) a very enticing idea; and overall, it shows how bumpy the process can be, instead of the idealized, pixie-dust-covered, "we magically made this movie and it's wonderful" version of the process.

I personally find one of the most fascinating and exciting parts of the animation world. Very rarely is something great on the very first draft and the way animation studios (not just Disney, as I'm sure Pixar, DreamWorks, Blue Sky and others go through a similar process) work through the studio is one of the things that actually attracted me to becoming an animation writer.

And Andreas Deja wasn't let go, he chose to abandon the project and work on Lilo & Stitch instead, because he didn't care for the new direction taken with Yzma.

Anyway, I found this to be a very fascinating documentary, especially seeing the animation from Kingdom of the Sun. Watching The Sweatbox, it actually makes me want to see other documentaries on similar troubled projects like Ratatouille, Shrek and Cool World. I know there's one being made about The Thief and the Cobbler.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:01 pm 
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Marce82 wrote:
BUT THE MAIN QUESTION REMAINS: SOTIRIS... HOW THE HECK DID U GET THIS FILM????


I just found it. Someone else leaked it online. I've searched for it in the past but I couldn't find anything at all. This workprint version must have been leaked very recently.

I would love to find the theatrical version though; hopefully someone will leak that as well soon.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:03 pm 
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When you think about it, the idea of a company like disney just spitting out magic is just insulting. These people put everything they have into these things, to sugarcoat it and say everything went off without a hitch is and always was a slap in the face. Animation is the illusion of life, not the workplace. Your going to have your highs and lows, but it's the lows that make the highs so much more gratifying, and that's what people will connect with.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 4:11 pm 
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Urghh. It's not downloading for me :(

Could some screenshot any unused animation (if any) and post it here please?

I would be really grateful!

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:37 pm 
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Well, I finally have seen the film now, thanks to jpanimation. After watching it, I think I can understand why Disney possibly didn't want it released a decade ago. I'm sure the emotion of the various players behind what ultimately became "The Emperor's New Groove" were still very fresh, and the guys who possible might be seen as "the villains" of this documentary, Peter Schneider and Thomas Schumacher, were still with the company (not that I think such a view is fully fair, I'm sure there are many animators today at Disney or Pixar that feel the same way about John Lassiter). Plus, as has been mentioned, Disney likes to sugar cote the animation posses with the public. The only other thing I could still keeping Disney from releasing the documentary is there is some course language, including a "F-bomb," but that stuff can easily be edited or bleeped out.

I think while maybe a decade ago some of these issue may have been strong enough to hold up a public releases of "The Sweatbox," I think now that we are 2012, it's time to release it. It would be great, especially if all the other great extras from the 2-disc DVD of "The Emperor's New Groove" don't make it onto the Blu-ray, if at least this documentary does. That said, I'm not holding my breathe.

I think it is a very honest look at the animation posses, and it realistically portray possible better then any behind-the-scene film yet of what it is actually like to work not just at Disney, but any animation studio. I would love to have seen the original, "Kingdom of the Sun" as it seemed like a really cool idea for a film. I really enjoyed the few songs that made it to "The Emperor's New Groove" soundtrack. I realize however that will probably never happen. If anything, all the more reason why this documentary should be released then, so that something from the original film is kept alive.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:09 pm 
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What I find particularly interesting is that I never saw Peter Schneider and Thomas Schumacher as "villains." Admittedly, I'm looking at the Kingdom of the Sun production with only this documentary and some articles to go on, but they seemed to just be giving honest and completely legitimate criticisms for how to improve the film. Of course, them being the "suits", that suggests wanting to take away from Allers and Dindal's artistic vision. But it's simply a case of them, much like the story team and even the directors feeling that the story needs improvement.

But that's just my point-of-view. I didn't work on the film, so I'm just speaking as an observer.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:46 pm 
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DisneyDude2010 wrote:
Urghh. It's not downloading for me :(

Could some screenshot any unused animation (if any) and post it here please?

I would be really grateful!

jpanimation wrote:
I'm uploading it to YouTube for members of this site. It's going to be a private video, so PM me if you want the link and include your YouTube user name (so I know to allow you access).

My offer still stands. It's pretty hassle free, you can even download it from one source if you have a YouTube download extension, which is why I'm surprised that only a couple of members have taken advantage of it.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:08 am 
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Is it a "private" private upload or an unlisted one you're doing?


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2012 12:12 am 
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Private, which is why I requested you include your YouTube user name. If I don't have that, then I can't grant you access and the link I include would be worthless to you. I'll try my best to grant access within a day of receiving a request.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:28 pm 
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So, I don't know if you guys have been around the interwebz lately, but The Sweatbox is online on YouTube, public video... for the time being anyway:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbydTb2xm8A

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/vbydTb2xm8A" frameborder="0"></iframe>

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:52 am 
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Dream Huntress wrote:
So, I don't know if you guys have been around the interwebz lately, but The Sweatbox is online on YouTube, public video... for the time being anyway:


For the time being is right! As soon as I saw that it was on YouTube I made it a point to watch it that night, because it's only a matter of time before it gets taken down. :( I know it's available for download but this was much more convenient.

Besides removing the cursing, I don't see why Disney doesn't put this on the eventual Blu-ray release of The Emporer's New Groove. They should also put the previously completed animation from Kingdom of the Sun in there too, even if it's not colored. I'd love to see the Yzma song in one piece and in HD. I really feel bad for Andreas Deja and his work on Yzma in the movie. You could tell he was so excited to be doing a female villain in the style of some of the dramatic villainesses of the past (Lady Tremaine, Maleficent, Cruella, etc.).

I also liked the little stone guy that sounded like he was voiced by Harvey Fierstein and saw that Owen Wilson had a voice role, too. Imagine landing a role in a Disney animated film and then having your part completely cut and removed to the point that no one ever knows you had a role in the first place!

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 12:46 pm 
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MJW wrote:
I also liked the little stone guy that sounded like he was voiced by Harvey Fierstein and saw that Owen Wilson had a voice role, too. Imagine landing a role in a Disney animated film and then having your part completely cut and removed to the point that no one ever knows you had a role in the first place!
I'm sure it would be disappointing for Harvey but he's been around the block and I'm sure he was OK. Wilson on the other hand was the star of the picture (Teen aged Pacha who switched with the Emperor) THAT must have been a shock! I'm sure they were paid and they both have worked for Disney since but WOW.

-Skyler

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:17 pm 
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What a fascinating documentary.

I have a question for you guys. I personally love what animator Dale Baer did with Yzma in the final film. However, the completed animation of the earlier "Kingdom of the Sun" Yzma by Andreas Deja, seems to be slightly superior.

In short, I marginally prefer Deja's animation (based on the clips we've seen) of Yzma, but would turn to Baer's work in terms of design. Deja's Yzma seems a little bit too detailed. Baer's looks more comically evil.

What do you think?


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:21 pm 
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Julian Carter wrote:
In short, I marginally prefer Deja's animation (based on the clips we've seen) of Yzma, but would turn to Baer's work in terms of design. Deja's Yzma seems a little bit too detailed. Baer's looks more comically evil.

What do you think?


Totally agreed. I was definitely thinking this while watching the early stuff Deja did. She just wasn't as appealing to me, which is kind of weird seeing as how he has done so many great villains. I'm definitely glad he decided to move onto Lilo. His work on her was fantastic.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:54 pm 
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I've always heard that this documentary showed just how incompetent the executive meddling was, but this shows the complete opposite of that, it showed a group of professionals trying to do the best work they could.

Honestly, besides the swearing, which can be easily censored, I don't see any reason why Disney couldn't realese this, if anything it would show a more vulnerable human side of their company, that could help people to not only see them as this huge money loving corporation.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:15 pm 
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Sotiris and jpanimation, thank you thank you thank you a billion times!!!

I jotted some notes while I watched it:

* The initial Manco/Pacha reminded me of Kenai and Chel...

* It's so enjoyable to watch Eartha Kitt's performances!!!

* OMG, the Animation Research Library!!! *drool*

* OMG, the footage from the movie. Omg. I <3 TENG, but this is amazing!!!

* The little color keys/layout workbook thumbnails are amazing- so small, yet so detailed!

* Sting's got a potty mouth! But he must've been okay with people seeing him like that because Trudie left the footage in the documentary. But I can see Disney not wanting that language attached to something Disney-related.

* Sting must have been brought on after it was decided to not be a big, epic, serious film, since it already had a man becoming a llama (but then, after he mentioned the epic-ness/massive scale)...

* They were still recording voices in December 1999??? That seems like such a small window!

* Kronk isn't Yzma's boyfriend!!!

* I feel for Sting, being in a different creative space, working on both his album and KitS.

* The "You've turned gay" comment from Sting's musical partner (David)...not Disney-friendly.

* I'm liking Sting singing "Perfect World" (but I do like Tom Jones' version, too, of course.) Yzma/Eartha singing it? Wow!!!

* Roy Disney!!! <3

* "Maybe they'll fire me, this afternoon if I'm lucky." Sting was just so over working on this film, huh? I mean, if Disney were to have bowed to his every whim at that point, I wonder if he would have been any more happy to work on it at that point.

* I wonder if it's weird/hard for non-English-speaking animators to animate based on the English vocal performances...

* I'm intrigued by the score-writing process, so I'm glad that was shown (even if just for a bit) in the documentary.

* OMG, the Happy Meal process!

* Were those the actual theme park character costumes??? (Google Images, I think, is telling me yes....)

Thanks so much again, you guys, for posting this!!! I wish I knew how to copy it to DVD!


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:48 pm 
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blackcauldron85 wrote:
Sotiris and jpanimation, thank you thank you thank you a billion times!!!


No problem! :wink:

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 1:01 am 
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And The Sweatbox has left YouTube ladies and gentlemen, I hope you guys got the chance to download it.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 1:10 am 
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It's on Demonoid. I got it there for better quality and burned it.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 1:19 am 
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blackcauldron85 wrote:
* The initial Manco/Pacha reminded me of Kenai and Chel...!


I thought the same thing. Makes me wonder if the idea for brother bear came directly from that.


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