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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:03 am 
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It´s been way too long since we´ve had any traditional GREAT villains. When will Disney go back to them?

And, let´s say Disney think they don´t want to go back to them since it´s "outdated". Disney can always go back to great characters that turn into villains. They have done that before: Clayton, Commander Rourke and even Kron are examples of this.

...sure, Clayton just by voice you could tell, but still he wore the same colors as Jane and her father so he wasn´t in your face.

But the lame "twist" villains don´t work. Especially because they´re not developed at all.

1. King Candy is the only one that worked because as him he was developed throughout the movie, he was always trying to forbid Vanellope to race and even when it´s shown that he was Turbo made sense and even the story of Turbo in the Arcade was something that was talked about every now and then in the movie to the point where it was even shown.

2. Hans was supposed to be a typical Prince trough and through. And I DESPISE him specifically because the movie lied to the viewers. When he first met Anna and she leaves and he´s under the boat he makes a happy/in love face. He was alone and nobody could see him. So it´s not like he had to fake. They wanted for him to be the villain all along? Fine. Then just don´t show him after Anna leaves. It wasn´t a twist to the viewers. It was a lie.

3. Callaghan; the same as Hans. Always shown to be a great teacher just to make the reveal that he was always a villain.

4. Bellwether is just a point below Hans because she was barely in the movie.

So as you can see classic Disney villains are missed and even if they don´t want to go that route they can do what they did in Tarzan, Atlantis and Dinosaur.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:55 pm 
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For me the thing is that surprise villains only works once. When you have already seen the movie, you know that he or she is the villain even if none of the characters doesn't. With characters like Ursula or Shere Khan on the other hand, you know straight away that they are villains. And the movies does not suffer from it. If a surprise villain is absolutely essential for the plot, I get ut. But sometimes all you need is a little rewriting of the script to find another approach.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2019 1:28 am 
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DC Fan wrote:
It´s been way too long since we´ve had any traditional GREAT villains. When will Disney go back to them?

And, let´s say Disney think they don´t want to go back to them since it´s "outdated". Disney can always go back to great characters that turn into villains. They have done that before: Clayton, Commander Rourke and even Kron are examples of this.

...sure, Clayton just by voice you could tell, but still he wore the same colors as Jane and her father so he wasn´t in your face.

But the lame "twist" villains don´t work. Especially because they´re not developed at all.

1. King Candy is the only one that worked because as him he was developed throughout the movie, he was always trying to forbid Vanellope to race and even when it´s shown that he was Turbo made sense and even the story of Turbo in the Arcade was something that was talked about every now and then in the movie to the point where it was even shown.

2. Hans was supposed to be a typical Prince trough and through. And I DESPISE him specifically because the movie lied to the viewers. When he first met Anna and she leaves and he´s under the boat he makes a happy/in love face. He was alone and nobody could see him. So it´s not like he had to fake. They wanted for him to be the villain all along? Fine. Then just don´t show him after Anna leaves. It wasn´t a twist to the viewers. It was a lie.

3. Callaghan; the same as Hans. Always shown to be a great teacher just to make the reveal that he was always a villain.

4. Bellwether is just a point below Hans because she was barely in the movie.

So as you can see classic Disney villains are missed and even if they don´t want to go that route they can do what they did in Tarzan, Atlantis and Dinosaur.


To be fair, Zootopia was about a mystery, so I can understand that the villain had to be secret, like in Scooby-Doo. And the movie gave away clues that it was her. It is not much of a mystery for the viewers if we know who the villain is from the start, like in "The great mouse detective" or "101 dalmatians".

The "suprise" villain is only bad in Frozen, I think. Because it comes from nowhere, no strong motivation and it never gives any clues about it.

It would have been so much better if Hans was still nice to Anna, but thought that Elsa was a treat to Arendelle because of the storm. He see how the people in Arendelle suffer. And that is why he wanted to kill her. He could just have been to busy with this plan that he doesn't noticed that Anna needed his help. She tries to tell him but he won't listen. Anna gets left alone in the room. And Hans wants her to be safe and locks the door because of that. Then he could be a good guy and a villain at the same time.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:02 pm 
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Well, Frozen actually foreshadowed Hans being the villain, if you look carefully. Even during “Love Is an Open Door”, you can see him being a step behind Anna throughout the song.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:15 pm 
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I really really really wish Disney would BRING BACK TRADITIONAL VILLAINS !!!

PLEASE DISNEY DO IT !! :angry:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:36 pm 
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DisneyJedi wrote:
Well, Frozen actually foreshadowed Hans being the villain, if you look carefully. Even during “Love Is an Open Door”, you can see him being a step behind Anna throughout the song.
I agree. Hans is the only one of the twist villains from Disney that actually worked, aside from King Candy/Turbo. I still remember the audience gasps when seeing Frozen in theaters. :P And people hate the character with a passion, too, where most of these others inspire no reaction from people at all either in the film themselves or outside them.

Callaghan and Bellwether shouldn’t have been as boring as they were because on paper they sound interesting. Disney just doesn’t have it anymore when it comes to villains or antagonists of any kind, really. You don’t even get something like Glut in TLM, the wolves in B&tB, the bear in The Fox and the Hound, the matchmaker in Mulan, or Sabor in Tarzan anymore.

As for the thread starter’s question, no, Disney won’t go back to the way they used to be. They’re PIXAR now.

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