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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:46 am 
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I honestly am pretty fine with them not doing a third one. I think the sequel wrapped the story pretty well. I would hate for them to backtrack the second one (like they did with the first) by having Vanellope return to Sugar Rush after making her move to Slaughter Race a big fat hoopla. But, I would really love them to do a TV show at the very least. I would love to see everyone develop even more and have each world explore. And again (sorry for being a broken record :oops: ), it's disappointing how they basically threw away Felix and Calhoun in the sequel, so I would love that pitch of their own sitcom come true (It clearly won't happen). I just pray that Disney doesn't abandon the WiR franchise completely again. :( I know that Tomorrowland ride was just revived because Disney thought the sequel would do phenomenal.

I don't know if the movie's box office affected the potential third one. I mean, it's doing better than it did a while ago. It caught up with the first one and it hasn't been released at other places yet. Like DisneyEra said, it's shocking that the Princesses gathered so little people to the movie. :o The Internet exploded with their trailer. I wonder if Disney will still do any future plans with them. The box office shows that they surpringsly aren't enough to sell a movie. Vanellope joining the lineup is pretty much dead now. :cry:


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 12:15 pm 
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Well, a TV series is still a possibility. Animated films that are moderately sucessful at the box office like Tangled and Big Hero 6 tend to get a TV show in lieu of another theatrical installment.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 2:30 pm 
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JeanGreyForever wrote:
The Rescuers used to be considered an A-List picture by Disney until the sequel tanked and then it was forever relegated with the other B-Lister films like The Aristocats and Robin Hood (which in fact have gained popularity over the years).

Is this true? I never realized that The Rescuers was ever that well-regarded. The strange things time does with films. Fantasia and Bambi both did awful on release, but are now best-selling classics. Dalmatians and Aladdin seem to have lost a little of their luster the past half decade or more (hopefully that won't be a continuing thing), while Hercules seems to have risen a degree (off the back of '90s kids' nostalgia, I suppose).

As for WIR's performance, I'm not surprised at all. That it got a sequel didn't surprise me because Disney's whole motivation into jumping into 3D so fully (killing off hand-drawn animation simultaneously) was to finally realize the lucrativeness of animated film franchises/endless sequels that PIXAR was hesitant to give them at first, but WIR just never had it. They're lucky that WIR2 has done as well as it has. I thought it would do half WIR's numbers, but the princesses apparently lifted it.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:29 pm 
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I didn't know that about The Rescuers. I always thought it didn't become a classic because it is such a bleak movie. you can see the despair of the animators in every frame. I actually thought The Rescuers Down Under was better.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 5:28 pm 
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farerb wrote:
You can see the despair of the animators in every frame.

:lol: It was the conditions during that time that forced Don Bluth and Gary Goldman to quit. I recall them saying in interviews that the treatment of the artists and the lowering of production values was the deciding factor. In relation to The Rescuers, Bluth cited they were not allowed to paint the white part of Bernard's eyes to reduce costs.

Gary Goldman wrote:
It was during the production of Pete’s Dragon and The Small One that we lost our innocence, and realized that the management, at that time, had little respect for the quality of the films and wanted us to stop trying to recreate the production values of the past and encouraged us to cut corners and reduce the cost of production. They made our lives as leaders very uncomfortable. And, basically saw the artists as just the laborers to cobble together product for them to sell. Don stepped down as Producer/Director and asked to just animate.
Source: https://alternativemagazineonline.co.uk ... oductions/

Don Bluth wrote:
Probably the straw that broke the camels back with me was when we were doing The Rescuers they decided not to paint the whites of the eye on the main characters and just paint the skin colour underneath because it would cost too much to paint.
Source: http://www.skwigly.co.uk/don-bluth-and- ... ng-disney/

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2019 11:29 pm 
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Sotiris wrote:
D82 wrote:
I found one song made for the film from Indonesia, though it's not a version of "In This Place" but a completely different one titled "Sebuah Lagu" from a group called Payung Teduh.

Disney Vietnam also created an original song titled "Phá đảo thế giới ảo" performed by the group UNI5 and singer Han Sara.

Thanks for sharing! I liked the Indonesian song more, but this one fits better with the style of the film.

Sotiris wrote:
The filmmakers said that the only reason Humphrey the Bear and Sorcerer Mickey were 2D in the film instead of CG is because they didn't have enough time to build and rig more CG models. The love and respect for hand-drawn animation at Disney never ceases to amaze me. :roll:

I thought it was strange these characters were 2D when other classic Disney characters like Grumpy were CG. Now we know the real reason.

JeanGreyForever wrote:
I'm seeing all these complaints about how Menken wasn't nominated at the Oscars, but I'm really curious as to how many of you legitimately felt that the song was Oscar-worthy material. As in, if Menken hadn't been behind the song, would you still rank it as a classic alongside When You Wish Upon a Star, Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah, Under the Sea, A Whole New World, Let It Go, etc.?

I think it's a good song, but not to the level of the ones you mentioned. Even though, as I expected, finally it wasn't nominated, I'm glad Disney made an effort to promote the song. And it made the shortlist, so that means Academy members liked it.

Sotiris wrote:
After Evermore being snubbed and I See the Light losing, a nomination would have proven to the industry Menken still got it. It would have raised his profile, making him more relevant and in demand. He needs that if he's ever going to get another original musical.

Yeah, I think if Menken had won for Enchanted, things would be different for him now. I hope he has better luck with the new Aladdin songs. Though after the snub of Evermore, I'm not holding my breath. I fear Academy members probably think they've awarded him enough in the past.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 12:31 am 
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Disney's Divinity wrote:
Is this true? I never realized that The Rescuers was ever that well-regarded. The strange things time does with films. Fantasia and Bambi both did awful on release, but are now best-selling classics. Dalmatians and Aladdin seem to have lost a little of their luster the past half decade or more (hopefully that won't be a continuing thing), while Hercules seems to have risen a degree (off the back of '90s kids' nostalgia, I suppose).

As for WIR's performance, I'm not surprised at all. That it got a sequel didn't surprise me because Disney's whole motivation into jumping into 3D so fully (killing off hand-drawn animation simultaneously) was to finally realize the lucrativeness of animated film franchises/endless sequels that PIXAR was hesitant to give them at first, but WIR just never had it. They're lucky that WIR2 has done as well as it has. I thought it would do half WIR's numbers, but the princesses apparently lifted it.

I read about it in this review and I've quoted the relevant portion.
http://animatedviews.com/2012/the-rescu ... e-blu-ray/

Quote:
It’s fairly odd to see a film from the same era as The Rescuers, in this case the concurrently released The AristoCats, seemingly getting more attention in Disney’s latest Blu-ray round-up, when that title has traditionally always been seen as a secondary one in the Studio’s animated canon while The Rescuers was for many years an A-list feature. I can’t think what has changed this perception other than the box-office rejection of the arguably just-as-good (and certainly technically superior) sequel, which unfairly seems to have tarnished both films’ future outlook on home video.

I've heard similar things elsewhere on the Internet though that back in the 70s-80s, The Rescuers was the only recent film that was hailed as a classic. It wasn't until the 90s that the film drastically lost much of its goodwill. I'm assuming that the sequel flopping had something to do with that. Just as likely is the fact that The Little Mermaid kickstarted the Disney Renaissance and created the new mold of musical films. The Rescuers being a huge success didn't fit the narrative that every film after Walt's passing had flopped until The Little Mermaid. The Rescuers, neither being a Walt-era film, nor being a 90s style Disney musical, unfortunately got lumped in with the rest of the B-List films, despite its success.

farerb wrote:
I didn't know that about The Rescuers. I always thought it didn't become a classic because it is such a bleak movie. you can see the despair of the animators in every frame. I actually thought The Rescuers Down Under was better.

Did you grow up with the sequel? A lot of people who grew up with the sequel tend to prefer it. The only thing the sequel does better than the original film is the animation. Even then though, The Rescuers was still better animated than its predecessors, namely Robin Hood and The Aristocats. So it was still a much-needed improvement.

D82 wrote:
Yeah, I think if Menken had won for Enchanted, things would be different for him now. I hope he has better luck with the new Aladdin songs. Though after the snub of Evermore, I'm not holding my breath. I fear Academy members probably think they've awarded him enough in the past.

I definitely wish Enchanted had won something, especially since I think it is quite one of his underrated works. I do believe Enchanted would have been able to win if the vote hadn't been split since several songs were nominated. At least it taught Disney to just focus on pushing one song during awards season.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 1:58 am 
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JeanGreyForever wrote:
Disney Duster wrote:
I must be the only one who really doesn't like "A Place Called Slaughter Race".

No, I'm with you there. And I haven't seen the song garner much attraction so it doesn't seem especially beloved by fans. I don't think our opinion is really that unpopular here.

Oh thank God.

Disney's Divinity wrote:
I never realized that The Rescuers was ever that well-regarded. The strange things time does with films. Fantasia and Bambi both did awful on release, but are now best-selling classics.

But I heard Bambi was a hit in it's initial release? Anyone know for sure?

I grew up with The Rescuers Down Under before I even knew their was an original film before called The Rescuers. I like the sequel more, but maybe that's nostalgia. I'd have to watch them again back to back. I think the sequel does things well except I guess having someone complicate Bianca and Bernard's relationship seems unnecessary.

JeanGreyForever wrote:
I definitely wish Enchanted had won something, especially since I think it is quite one of his underrated works. I do believe Enchanted would have been able to win if the vote hadn't been split since several songs were nominated. At least it taught Disney to just focus on pushing one song during awards season.

I agree, although I never thought that may be what Disney used to learn to just submit one song?

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 2:10 am 
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D82 wrote:
Sotiris wrote:
After Evermore being snubbed and I See the Light losing, a nomination would have proven to the industry Menken still got it. It would have raised his profile, making him more relevant and in demand. He needs that if he's ever going to get another original musical.

Yeah, I think if Menken had won for Enchanted, things would be different for him now. I hope he has better luck with the new Aladdin songs. Though after the snub of Evermore, I'm not holding my breath. I fear Academy members probably think they've awarded him enough in the past.


IMO, the Disney higher ups need to stop giving Menken so little room to work with in their movies. From writing a song just to replace another song (live action Beauty and the Beast), to writing songs for a musical where the directors didn't really want it to be a musical and were trying to condense the musical tones (Tangled), to writing a comedic "I Want Song" just for the sake of a joke/reference to other Disney films (Wreck-it Ralph), to making a song that is the best part of a terrible movie that had so many people walking out I wonder who even got that far (Holmes and Watson, yeah not Disney but it relates to the point), people are treating him more like the guy to get for quick songs without actually putting much thought nor giving him enough creative space.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 2:51 am 
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Warm Regards wrote:
[IMO, the Disney higher ups need to stop giving Menken so little room to work with in their movies. From writing a song just to replace another song (live action Beauty and the Beast), to writing songs for a musical where the directors didn't really want it to be a musical and were trying to condense the musical tones (Tangled), to writing a comedic "I Want Song" just for the sake of a joke/reference to other Disney films (Wreck-it Ralph), to making a song that is the best part of a terrible movie that had so many people walking out I wonder who even got that far (Holmes and Watson, yeah not Disney but it relates to the point), people are treating him more like the guy to get for quick songs without actually putting much thought nor giving him enough creative space.

Let's now forget how he was replaced with Randy Newman in The Princess and the Frog and then how he was essentially promised The Snow Queen, since he was working on the Tokyo park stage musical for it before being told that it would be reworked as a film first.

Disney Duster wrote:
But I heard Bambi was a hit in it's initial release? Anyone know for sure?

I grew up with The Rescuers Down Under before I even knew their was an original film before called The Rescuers. I like the sequel more, but maybe that's nostalgia. I'd have to watch them again back to back. I think the sequel does things well except I guess having someone complicate Bianca and Bernard's relationship seems unnecessary.

JeanGreyForever wrote:
I definitely wish Enchanted had won something, especially since I think it is quite one of his underrated works. I do believe Enchanted would have been able to win if the vote hadn't been split since several songs were nominated. At least it taught Disney to just focus on pushing one song during awards season.

I agree, although I never thought that may be what Disney used to learn to just submit one song?

Bambi was a critical hit like the rest of the Golden Age features, but also like the rest of the Golden Age features, it suffered from being released during WWII. That meant that the European market was cut off and Europe was oh-so important for the box office results of Walt's films. Snow White was a huge hit in part because the war hadn't started yet so it was screened throughout Europe.

None of the new characters really work for me in TRDU. Penny and Madame Medusa are far superior over Cody and McLeach for me, and the same goes for the rest of the film's respective supporting casts. Bianca and Bernard get the shaft in the sequel, Bianca especially. The mystery element from the first film is lost as well. It doesn't help that the Australian setting for the film was already dated by 1990 and as a result, the film is riddled with stereotypes. The subplot with the animals being locked up is never resolved, which makes you wonder why that was even tacked onto the film except to act as filler material. I also really liked the songs and general 70s vibe of the original film (even if some people complain that it dates the film...I think it adds character and makes the film a product of its time). TRDU doesn't even get any memorable songs to help mark it as memorable. Just Glen Keane's animation with Marahute and the opening sequence is really worth a watch imo.

I'm just assuming that Disney learned their lesson after Enchanted because since then, they've always focused on nominating just one song from their films, whereas with Enchanted, they had three songs nominated which I'm sure split the vote. That worked in the 90s, but it was way too competitive for them to rely on various songs afterwards.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 11:02 pm 
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JeanGreyForever wrote:
Let's now forget how he was replaced with Randy Newman in The Princess and the Frog and then how he was essentially promised The Snow Queen, since he was working on the Tokyo park stage musical for it before being told that it would be reworked as a film first.

He and Glenn Slater actually worked on the film adaptation of The Snow Queen too back when the project was hand-drawn, more faithful to the source material, and directed only by Chris Buck. So, he worked on two different adaptations of the fairy tale for Disney: the stage adaptation for Tokyo DisneySea (2002-2006) and the hand-drawn animated one for WDAS (2008-2010) before being given the boot for no apparent reason.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:29 am 
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JeanGreyForever wrote:
I definitely wish Enchanted had won something, especially since I think it is quite one of his underrated works. I do believe Enchanted would have been able to win if the vote hadn't been split since several songs were nominated. At least it taught Disney to just focus on pushing one song during awards season.

It not only taught Disney, the Academy also changed its rules the following year allowing just two songs from the same film to be nominated.

Warm Regards wrote:
IMO, the Disney higher ups need to stop giving Menken so little room to work with in their movies. From writing a song just to replace another song (live action Beauty and the Beast), to writing songs for a musical where the directors didn't really want it to be a musical and were trying to condense the musical tones (Tangled), to writing a comedic "I Want Song" just for the sake of a joke/reference to other Disney films (Wreck-it Ralph), to making a song that is the best part of a terrible movie that had so many people walking out I wonder who even got that far (Holmes and Watson, yeah not Disney but it relates to the point), people are treating him more like the guy to get for quick songs without actually putting much thought nor giving him enough creative space.

I agree. I wish they'd value him more and they'd give him better projects and more creative freedom.

By the way, thanks for mentioning Holmes and Watson. I didn't know about his participation in that film. I've listened to the song on Youtube and I really like it.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:44 am 
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Oh, ok thanks for explaining how you feel about TRDU JeanGreyForever, but I very fondly still remember the film despite all those things.

Bambi was an audience hit, too, wasn't it? Not like Snow White, but still a hit?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2019 3:34 am 
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Sotiris wrote:
He and Glenn Slater actually worked on the film adaptation of The Snow Queen too back when the project was hand-drawn, more faithful to the source material, and directed only by Chris Buck. So, he worked on two different adaptations of the fairy tale for Disney: the stage adaptation for Tokyo DisneySea (2002-2006) and the hand-drawn animated one for WDAS (2008-2010) before being given the boot for no apparent reason.

I forgot that technically Menken was on the actual film. I wish there was more material from his time on that film besides Love Can't Be Denied. I know that song was meant for the stage show, but I'm not sure if he was planning on using it in his iteration of the film, or if it had already been scrapped by then.

D82 wrote:
It not only taught Disney, the Academy also changed its rules the following year allowing just two songs from the same film to be nominated.

You're right, I completely forgot about that. I think that change was for the better imo, but I wish Enchanted hadn't been the film that had to essentially be sacrificed for the change to occur.

Disney Duster wrote:
Oh, ok thanks for explaining how you feel about TRDU JeanGreyForever, but I very fondly still remember the film despite all those things.
Bambi was an audience hit, too, wasn't it? Not like Snow White, but still a hit?

I'm glad you like it because that film needs some love lol. The only ones more unpopular and obscure would probably be the package films, The Black Cauldron, and some of the 2000s features.

Bambi was well-liked by audiences, American audiences anyway since only Americans were able to see it. The consensus was that Walt's films were masterpieces but because of the war, most people couldn't see them. Didn't Bambi get inducted into some prestigious film preservation society super early on?


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2019 9:55 am 
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JeanGreyForever wrote:
D82 wrote:
It not only taught Disney, the Academy also changed its rules the following year allowing just two songs from the same film to be nominated.

You're right, I completely forgot about that. I think that change was for the better imo, but I wish Enchanted hadn't been the film that had to essentially be sacrificed for the change to occur.

"Dreamgirls" also got three best original song nominations and lost the year before. So I think these back-to-back occurrences were what ultimately motivated the change.

Though looking back at those years, I think it was more than just vote splitting that caused other songs to win. The Oscars heavily promoted an environmental theme in 2006 and kept on bringing up on the show how eco-friendly the Academy and Hollywood were. I remember 2006-2007 was a period where companies were obsessed with proving how "green" they were. That's part of the reason why "Happy Feet" won the Best Animated Feature over "Cars" and also why a song from "An Inconvenient Truth" won the Best Original Song Oscar over "Dreamgirls."

Meanwhile, "Once" was an indie darling and was promoted as a Cinderella story, so I think that was a factor in "Falling Slowly" winning the Oscar over the "Enchanted" songs. "Once" was later turned into a Broadway musical, so it did have its fans.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2019 6:28 pm 
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estefan wrote:
. I remember 2006-2007 was a period where companies were obsessed with proving how "green" they were. That's part of the reason why "Happy Feet" won the Best Animated Feature over "Cars" and also why a song from "An Inconvenient Truth" won the Best Original Song Oscar over "Dreamgirls."
Or it was made a theme on the show because of those two winning, rather than being the cause of them winning.

A shame about Dreamgirls, too. Only vote-splitting could be the reason.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2019 1:26 am 
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I do really like The Rescuers Down Under but not enough to own it. I just like it enough to want to watch it if it's on or someone else has it. It seems to have a lot of love from people here and elsewhere.

Bambi did not do "awful" in theatets as Disney's Divinity said, which is what I was mostly trying to say. And yes, I think it got into the National Film Registry pretty early.

I didn't know the Dreamgirls movie had a bunch of new, original songs not from the musical.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2019 9:24 pm 
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Here are a couple of clips from the blu-ray extras:
https://www.cnet.com/news/ralph-breaks- ... recreated/
https://fanfest.com/2019/01/23/disney-r ... aster-egg/


estefan wrote:
"Dreamgirls" also got three best original song nominations and lost the year before. So I think these back-to-back occurrences were what ultimately motivated the change.

You're right, I didn’t remember that had happened to Dreamgirls just the year before.

estefan wrote:
Though looking back at those years, I think it was more than just vote splitting that caused other songs to win. The Oscars heavily promoted an environmental theme in 2006 and kept on bringing up on the show how eco-friendly the Academy and Hollywood were. I remember 2006-2007 was a period where companies were obsessed with proving how "green" they were. That's part of the reason why "Happy Feet" won the Best Animated Feature over "Cars" and also why a song from "An Inconvenient Truth" won the Best Original Song Oscar over "Dreamgirls."

Meanwhile, "Once" was an indie darling and was promoted as a Cinderella story, so I think that was a factor in "Falling Slowly" winning the Oscar over the "Enchanted" songs. "Once" was later turned into a Broadway musical, so it did have its fans.

Yes, it’s possible that there were other reasons why Enchanted and Dreamgirls didn't win best song. After all, other films have won in spite of having more than one song nominated.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:47 am 
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Cool crew T-shirt.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2019 9:28 am 
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"Ralph Breaks the Internet" has now hit $473 million worldwide, finally surpassing the final worldwide gross of "Wreck-It Ralph" (which made $471 million).

It probably has some more money to make before it finishes its run. The movie currently sits at $196 million domestic and I can see Disney trying to push it past the $200 million mark, which it will either do by itself or by attaching it to double bills with "Captain Marvel."

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