Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Rumpelstiltskin
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Rumpelstiltskin »

ce1ticmoon wrote:This French film looks quite promising, and will be getting a US release via Shout! Factory.
Looks interesting. But computers are obviously heavy involved in the making of the movie.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by unprincess »

^neat, though I have to admit for me it has the opposite problem that most CGI films have. Its a little too flat. I wish it had a bit more linework or subtle shading(nothing fancy, something like the shadowing used in the CAPs painted Renaissance era Disney films or the commercial below.) The story not being dumb downed is refreshing though...

Looks like Morton Salt decided to beat Disney at its own game and use the Feast technique(and some of its themes) to make a commercial...I love it & really wish I could see a full movie with this style.

http://www.cartoonbrew.com/advertising/ ... 32143.html
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Rumpelstiltskin »

unprincess wrote:Looks like Morton Salt decided to beat Disney at its own game and use the Feast technique(and some of its themes) to make a commercial...I love it & really wish I could see a full movie with this style.
But the presence of CGI can still be felt very strongly. It looks like they have used non-photorealistic rendering over CGI models, like Appleseed. Something feeling like CGI is not a bad thing when you make a movie that is supposed to feel that way, but when you try to make a movie that feels like it is drawn by hand, it has to be eliminated somehow.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by ajmrowland »

ce1ticmoon wrote:This French film looks quite promising, and will be getting a US release via Shout! Factory.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udtT4pVcP6Q[/youtube]
It really does look nice, though the visuals seem a little too simple.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Rumpelstiltskin wrote:
unprincess wrote:Looks like Morton Salt decided to beat Disney at its own game and use the Feast technique(and some of its themes) to make a commercial...I love it & really wish I could see a full movie with this style.
But the presence of CGI can still be felt very strongly. It looks like they have used non-photorealistic rendering over CGI models, like Appleseed. Something feeling like CGI is not a bad thing when you make a movie that is supposed to feel that way, but when you try to make a movie that feels like it is drawn by hand, it has to be eliminated somehow.
I know but Id still love to watch a CGI film that looks like this as opposed to the hundreds of others that are just "assault your eyes with hyper-realistic textures!"

Im sure Disney and Dreamworks could make a movie that looks like this without much expense & trouble but they'd probably think its too quaint looking to most audiences and not worth the risk.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Please help fund the animated feature The Glassworker on Kickstarter. If successful, it will be Pakistan's first hand-drawn animated feature.

The director, Usman Riaz, is a big proponent of 2D animation and is insisting on making it 2D despite advice against it. In the following interview, he talks about 2D animation and what makes the medium special to him.
There is a special kind of charm in hand-made imagery that no other form of art can capture. Whether it is hand-woven tapestry, carefully crafted portraits or simple sketches, man-made art always leaves an undying imprint on one’s mind and no matter how old it gets, the piece of art remains, in effect, a piece of art.

A good example of this would be Disney’s beloved fairytale Cinderella. It has been roughly six-and-a-half decades since the troubled princess first cast its spell on viewers but even today, its hand-drawn animation strikes a chord. It is for this reason that Usman Riaz has decided to incorporate the same technique in The Glassworker — his first animated feature film.

“Pakistan really has no hand-drawn animation industry. With this film and studio, we hope to lay the foundation and support a new generation of artists,” Usman told The Express Tribune. The venture will be produced under the banner of his brainchild business, Mano Animation Studio.

In a time wherein Computer Generated Images (CGI) is widely regarded as the way forward, Usman’s preference for a more traditional approach has raised quite a few eyebrows. Although he acknowledges that CGI has become the new frontier for film production and animation, he feels it cannot supersede the quality of hand-drawn images. “CGI is just another development in animation and I am not against it,” shared Usman, in support of his decision. “But one thing I love about hand-drawn animation is that it never looks old. If you watch Toy Story now, you will note that there is a lot of pixilation in its textures and roads. It looks a little obsolete. On the other hand, hand-drawn is just timeless!” he added.
Source: http://tribune.com.pk/story/1035170/usm ... ated-film/
"We are doing traditional hand drawn animation. The only difference is rather than drawing on paper and scanning the artwork onto the computer to ink and colour the frames, we are just directly drawing our frames using the Wacom tablets," says Riaz. "It’s a good balance of traditional and modern techniques."

"Hand drawn animation is timeless, just like the renaissance paintings we have on display in museums," he says. "It will always look fresh. There is just something so special about it."
Source: http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/201 ... ass-blower
“CGI,” adds Usman, “is like a sculpture while hand-drawn is like a painting.”
Source: http://tns.thenews.com.pk/mano-animation-studios/


He also talks about the challenges of putting together a 2D animation team in Pakistan.
Q: How did you bring your team together? Many of them are still in school—how did you come to start a whole animation studio with them?

Usman Riaz: The question was, 'How does one build a hand-drawn animation studio in a country with no background in it?’ The truth is, because there is no such industry Pakistan, there were no rules. And because there were no rules, I had no restrictions.

I realized there must be many people like me who loved animation but worked on their own. What if I were to bring these artists under one roof? I searched online for likeminded artists, architects, animators and video game designers, and spread the word by holding workshops in art schools about what I wanted to achieve. I managed to gather a small team of incredibly talented professionals (and students) from the UK, South Africa, Malaysia and of course Pakistan, where our headquarters are based.
Source: http://thecreatorsproject.vice.com/blog ... ature-film
Now, the young man is in the spotlight again, for a completely different reason: Usman will be writing and directing The Glassworker, Pakistan’s first fully hand-drawn animated film.

“I’ve loved hand-drawn animation ever since I was small. There is no animation industry here in my country. But we have a lot of people who do animation, who are commissioned to do it by people from abroad, or do it as a hobby. So I thought, why not bring everyone together in one group and start on something?” said Usman, 25, speaking from Pakistan via Skype.

Inspired by this trip, Usman formed Mano Animation Studios (the studio is named after his cat!) and assembled a team of animators from around the world. Around half the people working on his film are Malaysian; these include character designer and assistant lead animator Sofia Abdullah and environment designer Rachel Wan.

To finance his film, Usman put his project on Kickstarter in February this year, hoping to raise US$50,000 (RM20,130) for it. It achieved its goal in 16 days. To date, over 1,000 backers have pledged US$116,000 (RM467,038), which is enough for Usman to finish The Glassworker, as well as an exclusive behind-the-scenes documentary on how he put his animation studio together.

“I can’t even say this is a dream come true, because we didn’t even dream that we could be able to do it. I’m just very grateful,” enthused Usman.
Source: http://www.star2.com/people/2016/08/17/ ... ated-film/
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Former Disney animator Robert Shedlowich, who left the animation industry after it went all-CG, has some harsh words to say about computer animation.
Robert Shedlowich wrote:There isn’t any soul. The creative element is gone. Basically, the computer does all the work. It’s so dependent on software.
Source: http://www.mykawartha.com/news-story/62 ... d-passion/
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Andrew Millstein, the president of WDAS, talks about the future of 2D animation.
Q: As an animation major, I have a love for 2-D animation while CGI has taken over the industry. Do you see traditional animation making a comeback?

Andrew Millstein: Yeah, hand-drawn animation can have a life provided that the filmmakers have a full energy around it. It is all about the craft if you will and there is nothing that can conclude it from coming back. It would take the vision and the tenacity of the storytellers to embrace it as the means to tell their story.
Source: http://moviepilot.com/posts/3742857
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Sotiris wrote:Former Disney animator Robert Shedlowich, who left the animation industry after it went all-CG, has some harsh words to say about computer animation.
Robert Shedlowich wrote:There isn’t any soul. The creative element is gone. Basically, the computer does all the work. It’s so dependent on software.
Source: http://www.mykawartha.com/news-story/62 ... d-passion/
Which is true. I've probably stated this before, but to quote Albert Guiterrez; Most CGI movies are starting to look like each other. I don't dislike CGI in itself, it's just that's the CGI looks have become generic and safe.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Tangled »

Saying the "computer does all the work" really under-credits the talented artists who have to feed their designs into the computer. The process of creating concept art for a CGI film is the same as creating the concept art for a hand-drawn film, and animating fluid movement on a computer is an entirely separate talent on its own.

I really hate when people belittle the artists who still have to work in the CGI industry to earn a decent wage. It's not their fault that the higher-ups in animation companies make certain decisions.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Kyle »

Yeah, that thing about there being no creativity in CG is bs. Its perfectly fine to favor one over the other, but CG is just as creatively valid as hand drawn or stop motion. Its the suits that aren't allowing it to shine as much as it could be.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Tangled wrote:Saying the "computer does all the work" really under-credits the talented artists who have to feed their designs into the computer. The process of creating concept art for a CGI film is the same as creating the concept art for a hand-drawn film, and animating fluid movement on a computer is an entirely separate talent on its own.

I really hate when people belittle the artists who still have to work in the CGI industry to earn a decent wage. It's not their fault that the higher-ups in animation companies make certain decisions.
Were you referring to my response or to the article-quote?
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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DisneyFan09 wrote: Were you referring to my response or to the article-quote?
The article-quote. I respect Robert Shedlowich's decision to leave Disney, but that does not mean that the people who still work with the company are weak or uncreative. I also understand why you would think that CGI films look alike, even if I can't really agree. I think it's more so a problem for the industry rather than the medium. Most of the non-Disney hand-drawn films in the 90s and 2000s were very much rooted in Disney's style, since loads of successful 90s non-Disney animation directors (like Don Bluth or Richard Rich) originally started at Disney. Even then, animation companies were too worried to take risks with their art styles since only a few styles were proven to be both financially and critically successful. That idea still applies today.

The thing is, I do believe that hand-drawn was driven into the ground by the overuse/ripping off of the "Disney style", and the same thing could potentially happen to all-CGI films in the future. Probably not in the near future, but Dreamworks' recent failures and Disney's recent successes are pretty revealing. Disney is proving that princess musicals are still cool while Dreamworks, probably one of the reasons that Disney stopped making 2D musicals in the first place, is failing at staying relevant. Also, a Pixar movie flopped. However, Disney will probably interpret their success over other studios as reasons to make more CGI films rather than restarting the hand-drawn department.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Heil Donald Duck »

Well Since Walt originally released Snow White in 1937, total of 37 fully traditional animated feature have been made in the Walt Disney Classic/Cannon or whatever you want to call it, which also include 9 package film (which I'm not listing), and 8 CGI films (im not listing) or total 54 feature films. When looking at these 37 films you soon discover that films made during Walt's life are timeless classic, same with large majority of shorts made during that exact same time frame. You could argue that weakest films during Walts life are those last three in terms of Animation/and or story. After Walt the studio made some fine films in 1970's and 1980s but not commercial success. IT wasn't until glorious 90's () but intally made some fine film at turn of century but not as commerically successful as in 1990s but I would like to think that bottom started to fell out with Brother Bear and Home of Range which I find extremly weak films. Then they tried again with the Princess and Frog but I think timing probably caused it to not be that successful and Im not convinced it was good move to make fully animated Pooh movie probably turned many viewer possible adult viewer away. I don't think it was good move eather to make John Lasster as head of the studio a guy that priotites CGI, (and if you didn't know Lasster was originally sacked from Disney in 1980's for these exact reasons). So Lasster took Snow Queen that has been originally attempted by Walt (but never saw light of day) and turned it into Frozen and CGI finally hit it big at the studio. So you have to wonder if Frozen as traditionally Animated film was what studio need to keep Walt's tradition alive that was started in back in 1937 or 79 years ago. It was hijacked by someone that priorities CGI and Traditional animation left in the dark, and doesn't look like its going to see light of day any time soon.
So maybe its fitting if Disney is never going to make another fully traditional animated feature film that the total number of films released stands at 37 or at the exact same number as the last two digits the year was when Walt released his first Animated feature film in 1937.


During Walt life:
Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs (1937)
Pinocchio (1940)
Dumbo (1941)
Bambi (1942)
Cinderella (1950)
Alice in Wonderland (1951)
Peter Pan (1953)
Lady and the Tramp (1955)
Sleeping Beauty (1959)
One Hundred and One Dalmatians (1961)
The Sword in the Stone (1963)
The Jungle Book (1967)

After Walt:
The Aristocats (1970)
Robin Hood (1973)
The Rescuers (1977)
The Fox and the Hound (1981)
The Black Cauldron (1985)
The Great Mouse Detective (1986)
Oliver & Company (1988)
The Little Mermaid (1989)
The Rescuers Down Under (1990)
Beauty and the Beast (1991)
Aladdin (1992)
The Lion King (1994)
Pocahontas (1995)
The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996)
Hercules (1997)
Mulan (1998)
Tarzan (1999)
The Emperor's New Groove (2000)
Atlantis: The Lost Empire (2001)
Lilo & Stitch (2002)
Treasure Planet (2002)
Brother Bear (2003)
Home on the Range (2004)
The Princess and the Frog (2009)
Winnie the Pooh (2011)
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Heil Donald Duck »

Kyle wrote:Yeah, that thing about there being no creativity in CG is bs. Its perfectly fine to favor one over the other, but CG is just as creatively valid as hand drawn or stop motion. Its the suits that aren't allowing it to shine as much as it could be.
Thats not a BS CGI looks all the same no matter the studio (I cannot tell a disney, Pixar, Dreamworks, Blu sky form each other unless I look up information), but with traditional animation you can almost always tell which studio made said film or in what era and stopmotion probably takes twice as much time or more to make than CGI.

Jerry Beck's list makes for intresting reading:

http://cartoonresearch.com/index.php/an ... e-guide-1/
http://cartoonresearch.com/index.php/an ... e-guide-2/
http://cartoonresearch.com/index.php/an ... e-guide-3/
http://cartoonresearch.com/index.php/an ... e-guide-4/
http://cartoonresearch.com/index.php/an ... e-guide-5/
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Ive seen some creative amazing stuff on YouTube/online that is CGI. Its the suits that dont let the big studio CGI films be more creative. I think when Disney was doing 2d back in the 90s/early 2000s and they were really the only game in town they were a little more confident that they could tweak styles a bit. Now the competition is so cutthroat that nobody wants to dare do something different. :(
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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unprincess wrote:Ive seen some creative amazing stuff on YouTube/online that is CGI. Its the suits that dont let the big studio CGI films be more creative. I think when Disney was doing 2d back in the 90s/early 2000s and they were really the only game in town they were a little more confident that they could tweak styles a bit. Now the competition is so cutthroat that nobody wants to dare do something different. :(
I have mentioned it earlier, but these days CGI has come so far that much of it looks really great. Hand-drawn animation in the past often tried to add depth, dimensions and other elements that computer animation does much better. So rather than trying to do something that is so easy to achieve with CGI, focus instead on what hand-drawn does best. Lines, character animation and style. When the crew no longer have to waste time and energy on these things, they can concentrate on what really makes a hand-drawn movie worth watching. In some ways, computer animation have liberated hand-drawn animation, as it no longer have to carry the burden of making it look three dimensional. It also allows you to get away with things. Have you seen the way Goofy's car moves in Mickey's Trailer? Imagine a car moving like that in Pixar's Cars. When Studio Ghibli made Ponyo, Miyazaki wanted zero CGI, and it shows. And if you do need it, keep it on a minimum. If practically everything except the characters are computer animated, why not go all the way instead?
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by estefan »

I can also never agree with what everyone says about "all CGI looking the same." I think each major computer animation studio has a clearly different house style.

Disney and Pixar have a clearly similar house style, considering they're run by the same management and occasionally share artists, with both clearly taking a lot from the classic Disney style with the big eyes and such. Though, even then, Merida looks very different from Rapunzel and Elsa.
Blue Sky's style always changes with each movie, depending on what story they're telling. Robots and Epic are like William Joyce illustrations come to life, The Peanuts Movie looked exactly like the comic strips and tv specials, Horton Hears a Who looked a lot like the Dr Seuss illustrations. Even the animals of Rio look distinct from the animals of Ice Age.
Illumination Entertainment uses Eric Gullion for all of its character designs, creating a specific distinct style. Something that always stands out for me are the eyes and mouths.
Sony Animation prefers a more simplistic style. The cast of Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs are basically CG versions of Lord and Miller's Clone High characters and the Hotel Transylvania denizens clearly come from Genndy Tartakovsky's imagination (when he came on board to direct, he pretty much re-designed all of the characters).

Even DreamWorks doesn't reuse the same designs for all of their films. If you look at the three 2014 releases, for example, the Mr Peabody and Sherman designs favour more cartoonish large heads on a small body for Sherman and the kids. As opposed to How to Train Your Dragon 2, which went for a more anatomically correct approach for Hiccup and Astrid. The dragons of that film also look very different from the more angular animals featured in The Penguins of Madagascar.
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

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Alê Abreu, the director of the Oscar-nominated Boy and the World, talks about the homogenization of style and technique in the animation industry.
Q: In the U.S., Pixar’s style of 3D animation rules the day. What are your thoughts on current trends in animation technique?

Alê Abreu: I think animation is a big universe that is infinite. It doesn’t have an ending, but is a very beautiful, rich universe. What I see happening with the movies is that there has been a standardization of the movies itself, like all the movies came out from the same production company. And I think this is very poor, because if they are standard, they’re not taking advantage of the full scope; animation can be much more than that—can be much more than just technical.

Priscilla Kellen: Many times, animation is taken as if it was the language itself, but it’s just technique, and with this technique, you can reach many languages. Each story should have its own language. I would dare to say that I don’t think Alê would make another movie with the same language, with the same styles that he used for Boy & the World.
Source: http://deadline.com/2016/02/oscars-boy- ... 201701131/
His heart also remains drawn toward animation. “I have a very strong desire to use drawing as my main method of expression,” he maintained. But then he closes with a nod toward a phenomenon, that also speaks to some of the recurring issues the Academy grapples with in terms of what’s real and what’s animated, in an era where nearly all films are at least partially rendered: “There’s no reason an animation project can’t be transformed into live action,” he said, contemplating a film’s journey going the other direction. “To me these borders are increasingly blurred nowadays.”
Source: http://www.btlnews.com/awards/contender ... the-world/
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Re: Hand-Drawn Animation Dead at Disney

Post by Disney's Divinity »

The repetitive look of animated films falls in line with everything else movie-related these days. Money first, and releasing films that are as close to the exact same thing over and over is a business move. It's the same reasoning for the multitude of sequels, the live-action re-makes, the formulaic storyline beats and buddy setups, etc. If they didn't have to change the characters/designs every time, they would just release the same movie every year. :lol:
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