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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 7:18 pm 
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I think the main issue people have with this decision is that every Disney movie made, or is in production recently has underwent major changes, while most Pixar films get out of it unharmed. I know Pixar makes good movies, but I hope they don't want to make Disney look like a second Pixar, only in 2D animation.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 11:08 am 
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I agree, KubrickFan. Ratatouille, though, did go through some changes- the director did change, anyway.

I know I already said it, but my issue is with John Lasseter's loyalties. I don't doubt that he loves Disney, because I'm positive that he does. But he had been loyal to Pixar and only Pixar for so long, and he's used to Pixar movies being praised as the best...he surely wants that to continue; do you really think that he wants a DAC to overshadow and do better at the box office than a Pixar film? I don't think so.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:28 pm 
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yukitora wrote:
What I wonder is whether or not Rapunzel is getting another rehaul (I know this isn't a word but whatever :P) or not.
I totally love that picture of the prince climbing up the tower, even if it is just concept art. I sincerely hope this film is still going to represent Glen Keane's initial vision.

That tower in the clouds with that prince was not his initial vision! I am so upset that his original vision, "old" now might be the new concepts we've seen, "new":

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A lot of people love the tower so high it's in the clouds, but Snow White had a castle in the clouds at the end, Cinderella had one throughout, and even Sleeping Beauty went from castle to clouds in the end. The previous tower looked far more unique, gave the heroine more room up top, and was in a much more lush environment, that, in its cheeriness, makes sense for a witch who wants to keep her adopted daughter cheerful and safe from the world's evils.

An environment so rich it looks like there's butter between the strokes, as Glen Keane said he wanted. For more info, please check out this link: Glen Keane's beautiful vision for Rapunzel.

Amy, John Lasseter actually...umm...either he submitted Miyazaki's Spirited Away for Best Animated Feature, contending with his own Monsters Inc., or he helped run the campaign for Spirited Away to win...I read something about hims doing something that helped Spirited Away win Best Animated Feature when he was also running for it with his own Pixar film. Can someone help me on this? But anyway, it shows maybe he does care about other studios even when they contend with his own films.

However, perhaps his order of who's the greatest, and who he loves most, is Miyazaki, Pixar, then Disney! Miyazaki's still making massive hits, movies Lasseter can love, while Disney ain't. He helped Spirited Away because he loved it.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:54 pm 
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Poody wrote:
Wow, more reasons for me to believe that Lasseter is a complete idiot.....


But to be honest, I want to know what was so horrible about the cut he saw from Glen. If it was not a traditional fairytale style, then I say goodriddens! But I highly doubt that's the case. :roll: After watching Sleepying Beauty, I was hoping that Rapunzel could be a similar style film in CG.... obviously it would be more modern and what not though.....

I guess this is why they had nothing to say about Rapunzel at Comic-Con.... :lol:

Agree,it looks like he's trying to turn Disney into Pixar.
I don't mind that he fixed TinkerBell but will they finally release Rapunzel? so what now? it won't be release in 2010?.
I"m also worried what the new version will be like.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:11 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
Amy, John Lasseter actually...umm...either he submitted Miyazaki's Spirited Away for Best Animated Feature, contending with his own Monsters Inc., or he helped run the campaign for Spirited Away to win...I read something about hims doing something that helped Spirited Away win Best Animated Feature when he was also running for it with his own Pixar film. Can someone help me on this? But anyway, it shows maybe he does care about other studios even when they contend with his own films.

However, perhaps his order of who's the greatest, and who he loves most, is Miyazaki, Pixar, then Disney! Miyazaki's still making massive hits, movies Lasseter can love, while Disney ain't. He helped Spirited Away because he loved it.


First of all, early Disney features are ultimately Lasseter's source of inspiration. Why else would he start his career there.

Second, the year in wich Spirited Away won Pixar had no film in release. Spirited Away competed with:

Ice Age (2002) - Chris Wedge
Lilo & Stitch (2002) - Chris Sanders
Spirit: Stallion of the Cimarron (2002) - Jeffrey Katzenberg
Treasure Planet (2002) - Ron Clements & John Musker


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 5:58 pm 
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PatrickvD wrote:
Disney Duster wrote:
Can someone help me on this?

Thanks PatrickvD! And yea, I know Lasseter loves Disney's old classics, but what about these new films coming out?

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 4:04 pm 
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Jim Hill Media has posted an intesting article about the directorial change on Rapunzel. Have a looksie:

http://jimhillmedia.com/blogs/jim_hill/ ... debut.aspx

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 8:54 am 
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http://www.animated-news.com/2008/glen- ... -director/

According to AWN, Disney has confirmed that Glen Keane has chosen to step down from directing Disney’s upcoming animated feature Rapunzel due to a personal, non-threatening health issue. Keane, with his directing partner Dean Wellins, has been serving as director of the film for nearly two years. The report also suggests that the new directing team on Rapunzel will be Byron Howard (co-director of Bolt) and Nathan Greno (the head of story on Bolt). Keane will continue to be involved as the film’s executive producer and directing animator. Disney is anticipating a 2010 release for the film.

It's old news now, but it's confirmed by Disney that Glen Keane isn't directing due to his health problems...I wonder if that's just Disney's PR team not telling the whole truth, though...did Lasseter have nothing to do with it? If Glen were healthier, would he still be directing?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 12:34 pm 
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I also heard something about Glen having a small heartattack a while ago. Don't know how accurate that is, but in recent years Keane has started to look a little bit overweight to me, so maybe he really does need to deal with his health.

I guess his health issues combined with the lack of substantial work done on the script over the past two years made Lasseter decide to get new directors on board.

What interests me most is Lasseter's faith in the Bolt story guys. He must like Bolt enough to trust these guys with probaply the most expensive Disney feature to date. Lasseter never really liked Meet the Robinsons so if that means Bolt is another step up in the right direction that's very exciting to me.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 1:05 pm 
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Patrick wrote:
He must like Bolt enough to trust these guys with probably the most expensive Disney feature to date.


Do you mean Rapunzel is likely to have a price tag even larger than 1999's Tarzan? Wow!

Patrick wrote:
Lasseter never really liked Meet the Robinsons.


Why? I thought he praised it when it was nearing the release date.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 11:03 am 
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Julian Carter wrote:
Patrick wrote:
He must like Bolt enough to trust these guys with probably the most expensive Disney feature to date.


Do you mean Rapunzel is likely to have a price tag even larger than 1999's Tarzan? Wow!

Patrick wrote:
Lasseter never really liked Meet the Robinsons.


Why? I thought he praised it when it was nearing the release date.


he didn't really praise it. He called it a fun little film. Wich, if you can read between the lines, means that he's probaply relieved that he was able to fix the mess it was initially. That doesn't mean it's up to his standards. He's very demanding.

And reportedly, Rapunzels budget is set to exceed the price tag of Home on the Range and Tarzan, the two most expensive films Disney ever made.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:00 pm 
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PatrickvD wrote:
he didn't really praise it. He called it a fun little film. That doesn't mean it's up to his standards. He's very demanding


Yeah, that explains Cars :roll:

PatrickvD wrote:
And reportedly, Rapunzels budget is set to exceed the price tag of Home on the Range and Tarzan, the two most expensive films Disney ever made.


Ok, i can understand Tarzan but why Home on the Range? Is it because of all the re-working the film underwent? I just can't see anything so expensive in terms of animation or effects.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:07 pm 
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PatrickvD wrote:

And reportedly, Rapunzels budget is set to exceed the price tag of Home on the Range and Tarzan, the two most expensive films Disney ever made.


Wow! Home on the Range one of the two most expensive Disney films ever made? I'm quite surprised because this movie doens't look to me as having much special effects or breaking new grounds in animation like Tarzan did with deep canvas. Was it expensive because of story problems, causing delays? I really like to know.

Still looking forward to Rapunzel a lot.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 12:33 pm 
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BelleGirl wrote:

Wow! Home on the Range one of the two most expensive Disney films ever made? I'm quite surprised because this movie doens't look to me as having much special effects or breaking new grounds in animation like Tarzan did with deep canvas. Was it expensive because of story problems, causing delays? I really like to know.


I think we are asking the same thing here :wink: :D *Look post above*

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:21 pm 
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I found it unusual that Jim Hill posted a positively-spinned story about this rumor. Normally it's mostly negativity about Disney decisions from him.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:52 pm 
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sotiris2006 wrote:
PatrickvD wrote:
he didn't really praise it. He called it a fun little film. That doesn't mean it's up to his standards. He's very demanding


Yeah, that explains Cars :roll:


oh sure, because Cars was horrible :roll: Name me one Disney film with a better response (critically and commercially) than Cars this decade? So Lasseter isn't allowed to make a movie that's just okay instead of amazing, because he's in charge? Walt Disney made Alice in Wonderland. We all forgave him for that. Let's move on.

sotiris2006 wrote:
PatrickvD wrote:
And reportedly, Rapunzels budget is set to exceed the price tag of Home on the Range and Tarzan, the two most expensive films Disney ever made.


Ok, i can understand Tarzan but why Home on the Range? Is it because of all the re-working the film underwent? I just can't see anything so expensive in terms of animation or effects.


They animated a LOT that never made the final cut. I guess the studio was such a mess at this point they forgot that you don't start shooting/animating an unfinished script/storyboard. It always leads to exploding budgets. Exibit A: Pirates of the Caribbean sequels ($600 million combined) OUCH.

Disney said HOTR's budget was $110 million, but rumor has it it equaled Tarzan's $140 million. Wich I forgot to mention is also the rumored budget for Treasure Planet. At the time Disney couldn't afford the bad news, so they fudge a lot of numbers making a lot of these budget just rumors even to this day. Especially not with them closing down the Florida Unit, who delivered hit films like Mulan, Brother Bear and Lilo with price tags in the $80 million range. Burbank was in much more trouble at the time. New Groove and Atlantis also cost $110 and $120 million respectively. Half of that money probaply isn't even in the final film

also I forgot, the most expensive film Disney ever made was actually Chicken Little, wich cost over $150 million.

That's why Princess and the Frog iss being animated by a small crew right now. To avoid the budget exploding. They're trying to make that film for less than $80 million.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:15 am 
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1. big name talent costs money (Eddie Murphy gets 10 - 20 million per flick)
2. tons of overhead gets tacked on
3. they keep redoing and redoing and redoing things until whoever is producing / directing is happy, or until that producer / director is removed and another producer / director tries to finish the film.
All of that costs money.

#3 they can do something about if they plan the story well __before__ they start animating. And given the power of digital tools these days, only a handful of people are needed to make any decent feature.

Sometimes, they pull it off for a tiny budget. CINDERELLA III cost only $6 million, and despite some budgetary rough edges holds up well compared to the bigger features. RETURN TO NEVERLAND cost around $24 million (that may have been the highest budgeted film the now gone Disney Australia ever did), and was a well polished film.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:49 am 
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Murphy never got that kind of money for Mulan.

Only Dreamworks spends millions on voice talent. I don't think Disney does this.


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