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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 3:56 pm 
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Wonderlicious wrote:
Disney Duster wrote:
Maybe he still super duper loves Jesus.


Alan Menken is actually Jewish. :p
How do you know.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 6:54 pm 
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TsWade2 wrote:
Wonderlicious wrote:
Disney Duster wrote:
Maybe he still super duper loves Jesus.


Alan Menken is actually Jewish. :p
How do you know?


I think it was briefly mentioned in the Alan Menken retrospective on the Aladdin Platinum Edition DVD, though I can't quite remember. In any case, he appears on this list:

http://www.jinfo.org/Academy_Award_Original_Song.html

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:36 am 
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Does it matter what his religion is?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 12:09 pm 
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SWillie! wrote:
Does it matter what his religion is?


No, not at all. :)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:36 pm 
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Oh yea, I think I do remember he is Jewish.

SWillie! wrote:
Does it matter what his religion is?

Does anything on this forum matter? I say yes. Geeze I'm just discussing something.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:01 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
SWillie! wrote:
Does it matter what his religion is?
Does anything on this forum matter? I say yes. Geeze I'm just discussing something.


I wasn't saying it like that, I was just honestly wondering if anyone really cares what his religion is. It's his music that matters, in my opinion. You seemed disappointed to hear that he might not be a devout Christian. You say his religion does matter... does that mean you wouldn't like his music as much if he were an atheist or a buddhist or something else?

I don't really understand the connection between Disney and Christianity you made either, because the company is made up of the biggest diverse group of people you'll ever find in a company, from all different religions. Sure, they've made some films that have Christian ideas in them, but they've also made films that have references to other religions as well.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:06 pm 
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Come on man. Knowing certain things about people will always effect how you feel about them and their work. In this case, no, him being Jewish doesn't make me think anything very different about him or his work at all.

But Disney has a super Christian reputation. Just...it does. And that includes the kind of people who are attracted to Disney. This forum may be an exception because I'm talking about the general people not hardcore fans who spend so much time on a forum.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:17 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
But Disney has a super Christian reputation. Just...it does.


Can you elaborate on this? Because I really don't get that connection.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:28 pm 
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If anything, Christians are notorious for attacking Disney as an evil, anti-Christian company, because they supposedly promote pagan religions through their depictions of magic, sorcery, witchcraft, etc. in their entertainment.

Just try typing out both "Christians" and "Disney" in an online search and see all the crazy crap that comes up. My personal favorite point? "Mice in the Old Testament are unclean animals Leviticus 11: 29 and Isaiah 66:17. The enemy has created the image of an unclean animal as the symbol for happiness."

Hence, Mickey Mouse is an evil, anti-Christian symbol. Gotta love that. :mickeyface:

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:39 pm 
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enigmawing wrote:
If anything, Christians are notorious for attacking Disney as an evil, anti-Christian company, because they supposedly promote pagan religions through their depictions of magic, sorcery, witchcraft, etc. in their entertainment.


I'd also be inclined to say that those critics are well and truly thorough-bred fundamentalists, so I wouldn't associate most Christian Disney fans as that. I know that a lot of mainstream Christians admire Disney for promoting positive values. Regardless, I wouldn't class such traits as being exclusive to Christianity; the diversity within Disney fandom is a testament to this.

Anyway, let me also remind others that a religion thread exists elsewhere, and now may be a good time to get back onto the subject of Alan Menken. I'm sure he wouldn't enjoy reading a thread about him turning into some never-ending religious discussion.

EDIT: And I just found something that is indeed related to Alan Menken! Well, perhaps more to Howard Ashman, but somebody on YouTube has posted some demos for The Little Mermaid, Aladdin and Beauty and the Beast featuring vocals from both collaborators. Particularly interesting is an extended version of "Arabian Nights", as well as some deleted songs. The account holder has some other interesting Disney song videos up as well (such as an extended "Legend of the Sword in the Stone" song from The Sword in the Stone and several unused Pinocchio songs):

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZVLTpKmOvnE" frameborder="0"></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/CU1x7yPRwGk" frameborder="0"></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/H2eq7PvJpqk" frameborder="0"></iframe>

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Jk66Rb4mN-0" frameborder="0"></iframe>

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Last edited by Wonderlicious on Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 7:42 pm 
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It was not turning into that. Don't make a bigger deal out of this than it was. Things come up in thread all the time. What is with the off-topic nazism. Whatever, I think that Disney is really really popular with Christians starting all the way back to Snow White praying. If you don't think so, fine, so you haven't heard and seen or noticed all I have.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:09 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
It was not turning into that. Don't make a bigger deal out of this than it was. Things come up in thread all the time. What is with the off-topic nazism. Whatever, I think that Disney is really really popular with Christians starting all the way back to Snow White praying. If you don't think so, fine, so you haven't heard and seen or noticed all I have.


Well, yes, that is certainly true... but that doesn't give Disney a "Christian reputation." I understand that, being a Christian, you will obviously be more inclined to see the Christian references, just as I have. But that doesn't mean that the company is a Christian company. I think it's best not to give the company a religion like that, as it would push others away.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 8:17 pm 
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Wonderlicious wrote:
I'd also be inclined to say that those critics are well and truly thorough-bred fundamentalists, so I wouldn't associate most Christian Disney fans as that. I know that a lot of mainstream Christians admire Disney for promoting positive values. Regardless, I wouldn't class such traits as being exclusive to Christianity; the diversity within Disney fandom is a testament to this.

I was just responding to Duster's opinion that Disney has a "super Christian reputation," which I haven't noticed much of outside of Walt's lifetime (i.e. Johnny Appleseed, Ave Maria, Trees). Not saying that all Christians are as critical as the extremists I just mentioned, it's just that the very first association that comes to my mind when involving Christianity and Disney is extremely negative. This has to do with personal observations I made growing up in the Midwest U.S., a subject which is not appropriate for further discussion in a thread such as this.

Wonderlicious wrote:
Anyway, let me also remind others that a religion thread exists elsewhere, and now may be a good time to get back onto the subject of Alan Menken. I'm sure he wouldn't enjoy reading a thread about him turning into some never-ending religious discussion.

Despite wanting to get one final word in, I agree. I don't believe this thread is out of hand yet, but it might well be on its way. Maybe we could have a thread specifically for discussing religious issues with Disney, but I imagine it might be a difficult thread to keep open. In the meantime, if anyone is uncomfortable with the direction of this discussion they should be contacting a mod/admin.

SWillie! wrote:
I think it's best not to give the company a religion like that, as it would push others away.

Agreed. :)

Duster, are you feeling ok? You've seemed to be on the aggressive side lately with your posts in this section of the forum. :(

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 9:23 pm 
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SWillie! wrote:
Well, yes, that is certainly true... but that doesn't give Disney a "Christian reputation." I understand that, being a Christian, you will obviously be more inclined to see the Christian references, just as I have. But that doesn't mean that the company is a Christian company. I think it's best not to give the company a religion like that

I wasn't trying to. I was just observing. I would talk about this more but the off-topic nazis will be at me. >: P

enigmawing wrote:
Duster, are you feeling ok? You've seemed to be on the aggressive side lately with your posts in this section of the forum. :(

Wow are you kind. I'd say I'm fine. I'm gonna answer your pm too.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:54 pm 
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Funny enough, Walt Disney himself wasn't really that devout of a Christian either. Yes, he came from a Christian family, but he himself wasn't as much into Christianity as one thought he was. I learned about this when doing my research paper on Walt Disney for school which was interesting read. It was interesting to learn about. He encourage his daughters to go and believe what ever they feel they wanted to believe. He never really implicate any Christian values on anyone.

If I had to guess why there is a lot of Christian themes in Disney, it's because America is predominately Christian by population and they the audience would understand and associate with the Disney movie much easier and closer when a Christian theme or metaphor is implicated in the movie rather than say something from Buddhism.

This is also why most of his animated movies were adaption from existing stories like fairytale or novels. Because the audiences know the story and make it easier for the audience to watch the movie. This is why, outside of Fantasia (which didn't do well in box office anyway), Walt didn't make any "original" movies. I learn this in History of Cartooning also.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:21 am 
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Wondy, thanks for posting those demos! I've heard the Under the Sea one somewhere, but none of the others. I wish they would release all of this stuff on the official soundtracks.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:33 am 
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SWillie! wrote:
Wondy, thanks for posting those demos! I've heard the Under the Sea one somewhere, but none of the others. I wish they would release all of this stuff on the official soundtracks.

Are you familiar with this box set? :)

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:45 am 
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enigmawing wrote:
SWillie! wrote:
Wondy, thanks for posting those demos! I've heard the Under the Sea one somewhere, but none of the others. I wish they would release all of this stuff on the official soundtracks.

Are you familiar with this box set? :)

What?! No!! Hahaha... I should be though!


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 1:35 am 
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SWillie! wrote:
What?! No!! Hahaha... I should be though!

LOL! I picked up the set at a Musicland in Chicago back in 1994-95 for around $50 . . . on cassette. :lol: I eventually replaced it with the CD's much cheaper online though long after I lost the book from the original set (the book is itself is pretty nice).

It's really worth picking up. :) In fact, I left my second set behind when I moved and wouldn't mind replacing it again. :oops:

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:05 am 
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Chris, that's pretty cool info. Except, I feel Lady and the Tramp is really original, so I don't know if I believe all of that, not that I necessarily would anyway. But if it is true, all it really says is he'd be the kind of Christian I would be. Before you go saying how in the heck is that true, just...I'd like to be kinda like that, encouraging people but letting them go at the same time. Nevermind, just, can't talk about it here.

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