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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:51 am 
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Filmmakers can be incredibly flexible and have the ability to adapt their style, when making a film. Plenty of directors, known for older-skewering movies and television series, have successfully gone on to make a family film or two. Just to name a couple of examples: Steven Spielberg, Martin Scorsese, George Miller, Wes Anderson, David Silverman, Robert Zemeckis and so on.

And how do you know Rich Moore didn't want to work at Disney from the beginning, but the way his career went, he ended up directing on The Simpsons first. Though before that, he was an animator on Brad Bird's Family Dog and The New Mighty Mouse Adventures.

I'm an aspiring animation writer and Disney is a place I would like to work at in the future, but since I'm at that stage where I'll accept just about anything handed to me just for the work, I could end up writing on a Robot Chicken or a Futurama before doing anything at Disney. Let's say my career does pan out where my first writing job is on Robot Chicken, are you saying I shouldn't allowed to write for Phineas and Ferb or I shouldn't work on any future Disney animated feature?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:23 am 
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If anyone has any preconceived problem with Wreck-It Ralph or the choice of director and cast, to me the solution is simple: don't go and see the film. This isn't a feature-length episode of The Simpsons, Futurama, Family Guy or Robot Chicken, this is a WDAS film and there has been absolutely nothing to suggest that it will in any way be crude or violent or contain anything else that could be deemed inappropriate by Disney's standards. If certain people want to believe that they and they alone can tell the rest of us what qualifies as "Disney" or "un-Disney" then fine but, personally, I'm thrilled that those people aren't the ones actually making the creative decisions at WDAS these days, otherwise I think the studio would be in a very sorry state. I would much rather talk about the film itself than cast judgement on those involved with it based on things they've worked on in the past, especially when those things have no bearing whatsoever on the work that's being done on Wreck-It Ralph. Rant over, I'm very much excited to see this film in November.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:09 am 
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Disney Duster wrote:
Haha, like Apple is the same. Apple is about making everything new, no matter the cost. Walt always selected old stories, or old things, old traditional values and sensibilities, just with new methods or technology. Don't anyone bring that quote up about movng forward, because that quote does not specify what new things Walt would do, according to that you could say a "new thing" could be adding new sensibilities aka making evil win in a Disney flick.


Seriously? The more you make this point, the less informed you sound about the company. Walt created Tomorrowland which is entirely new, futuristic, and technologically forward. 101 Dalmatians was not an old classic when they made the film. Many/probably most of the Live action films the company made while Walt was alive we're based in the past or old things.

As an artist, I'm also insulted by your thought that people can't create things outside of a specific niche. It's just a wrong and ignorant statement.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:42 am 
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I don't think they would get away with making anything that crude or they will be given the pink slip. :P


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:10 pm 
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First, no I said there's adult and then there's the kind of adult in the shows mentioned, it's not the difference between adult and family it's teh difference between the kind of adult stuff they've done and Disney.

Next, when I say "bad' you don't seem to get what I mean. I don't mena low quality or less intelligent I mean it's a more cynical irreverent kind of thing different from the positive values of Disney.

Finally, yea Tomorrowland and stuff done in modern day, yea, that has to do with technology and things that happen today, but it still had old values and the technology just aided those old values, and things in those films just were, well, different.

And being someone who wants to work at Disney but works on Robot Chicken for a little is different from like a co-creator of Robot Chicken or a stand-up comedien making their own material, inventing such cynical humour in the first place.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 5:36 pm 
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singerguy04 wrote:
As an artist, I'm also insulted by your thought that people can't create things outside of a specific niche. It's just a wrong and ignorant statement.


Not that it'll make much difference ultimately, but I wholeheartedly second this. :clap:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 6:48 pm 
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Wonderlicious wrote:
singerguy04 wrote:
As an artist, I'm also insulted by your thought that people can't create things outside of a specific niche. It's just a wrong and ignorant statement.


Not that it'll make much difference ultimately, but I wholeheartedly second this. :clap:

Add me to the list :up:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:26 pm 
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singerguy04 wrote:
As an artist, I'm also insulted by your thought that people can't create things outside of a specific niche. It's just a wrong and ignorant statement.

Ha. That's not what I was doing at all. That's not what I think at all. Ha ha ha. I think what I actually said, which was not that, no matter what you say. You took it further into something I was not saying. I should actually be the one insulted by you twisting my words.

But do I think such people can creat the magic of Disney? No. It will take the people at Disney who really do get the Disney magic to transform their stuff into what it should be.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:44 pm 
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So, Duster, what do you say to the MANY animators at Disney who started out in the video game industry, creating horrifying and disgusting creatures - stories where sex and murder are often involved... and other such video game material, that now work at Disney, bring characters like Rapunzel to life?

Are they incapable of creating sincere, heart-warming, "Disney-esque" characters because they didn't get their start at Disney?


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 7:46 pm 
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:? I'm confused here. Maybe it's just your phrasing that I'm misunderstanding but you've said that someone is twisting your words and that...

Disney Duster wrote:
That's not what I think at all.


...in regards to another member saying that you have suggested that certain members of the cast and crew of Wreck-It Ralph are incapable of creating a Disney film as it's far removed from the types of things that they're usually involved with. And then a couple of sentences later you've said...

Disney Duster wrote:
But do I think such people can create the magic of Disney? No.


Maybe it's just me but that seems quite contradictory :? .

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:22 pm 
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DisneyAnimation88 wrote:
:? I'm confused here. Maybe it's just your phrasing that I'm misunderstanding but you've said that someone is twisting your words and that...

Disney Duster wrote:
That's not what I think at all.


...in regards to another member saying that you have suggested that certain members of the cast and crew of Wreck-It Ralph are incapable of creating a Disney film as it's far removed from the types of things that they're usually involved with. And then a couple of sentences later you've said...

Disney Duster wrote:
But do I think such people can create the magic of Disney? No.


Maybe it's just me but that seems quite contradictory :? .


That's cause it is. Duster doesn't seem to grasp such a simple concept around his head that people are capable of expanding outside the box. Just because some guy created an x-rated porno doesn't mean he's incapable or doesn't deserve to work on something like Disney and create something good and family friendly.

I'm with singerguy and also find Duster's statement ....very narrow minded. As an artist myself also, I find that notion ridiculous too.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:27 pm 
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I never said that artists can't do many different niches, did I? No, I didn't say that at all. I just said these people we are discussing, making Disney magic, no, they can't, and they shouldn't. I bet Walt would be disgusted and horrified.

SWillie! wrote:
So, Duster, what do you say to the MANY animators at Disney who started out in the video game industry, creating horrifying and disgusting creatures - stories where sex and murder are often involved... and other such video game material, that now work at Disney, bring characters like Rapunzel to life?

It depends. Did they work on anything truly x-rated or anti-Disney, or just shooting or monster games? And did they actually come up with such terribly anti-Disney ideas in such games, or did they merely serve on some animation help or design help, perhaps only designing the very cities such bad gaming action takes place in?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 8:54 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
It depends. Did they work on anything truly x-rated or anti-Disney, or just shooting or monster games? And did they actually come up with such terribly anti-Disney ideas in such games, or did they merely serve on some animation help or design help, perhaps only designing the very cities such bad gaming action takes place in?


Well, I don't know any details about what they specifically worked on, but I know many artists come from smaller areas of the industry, many of which are extremely different from Disney.

The point is - while yes, it is certainly a departure for Disney to go with an outsider as a director, especially an outsider that has been involved with more adult-oriented material, what's more important are the decisions being made for this movie. If it turns out that Wreck-it Ralph is full of adult jokes and mature satire, then what you are saying is fair - this shouldn't be a "Disney" film. But, there has been nothing - nothing - to make us believe that thus far, and so basing your opinion on the film solely on your preconceived notions as to what someone working on the film is like is extremely narrow-minded, let alone overly negative.

I understand your concerns. The concept of this film is still kind of difficult to grasp without seeing any kind of footage to give us an indication of how the film plays. It's hard to imagine it as a "Disney" film. But for all we know, the poor guy has been working on Fox shows for so long that for years he's wanted a chance to create something full of heart and full of emotion. He has his chance now, and I think we should all trust that he is capable of doing so unless he gives us reason to doubt. The fact that he has the entire team at Disney Animation on board with him is enough for me.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:50 pm 
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Would it help you get what I mean if I said: It's the principle of the thing? Not if they show stuff to Disney and Disney people like it, it's what it means to let such people work at Disney?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 9:54 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
Would it help you get what I mean if I said: It's the principle of the thing? Not if they show stuff to Disney and Disney people like it, it's what it means to let such people work at Disney?


You talk as if these people are actually bad people.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 10:41 pm 
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SWillie! wrote:
Disney Duster wrote:
Would it help you get what I mean if I said: It's the principle of the thing? Not if they show stuff to Disney and Disney people like it, it's what it means to let such people work at Disney?


You talk as if these people are actually bad people.

If Duster's logic is anything to go by, he probably thinks that's the case.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2012 11:37 pm 
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Disney Duster wrote:
I never said that artists can't do many different niches, did I? No, I didn't say that at all. I just said these people we are discussing, making Disney magic, no, they can't, and they shouldn't.


Uhh yeah pretty much you did.

Anyone who works in entertainment industry on the creativity side: actors/actress, artist, animators, comedians, singers, etc etc. Essentially are called artists.

The people you were bitching about fall under that category.


Disney Duster wrote:
I bet Walt would be disgusted and horrified.


I bet Walt wouldn't even give a shit.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 7:04 am 
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Well in some ways they certainly are bad.

Chris, no, I did not say that all artists out there can't work in more than particular niches, read what I said two posts ago.

I'm an artist too, so if anyone's insulted, you can't be when there's no insult to take.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 8:03 am 
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Disney Duster wrote:
Well in some ways they certainly are bad.


As is every human being. Everyone has flaws but these people haven't killed anyone or committed any kind of atrocity, all they're guilty of by your logic is working on films and TV shows with adult content so that makes them "bad". It's just ridiculously judgemental to make a claim like that. So are the people who watch and enjoy those things bad as well? These people aren't criminals, if WDAS is comfortable with hiring them for creative reasons then that's all that matters really. If you aren't comfortable with that then fine, it's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but no one is going to force you to watch the film so rather than preach to a group of people on this forum who disagree with your logic (and in some cases find it insulting), why not just ignore the film if so many things about it are blasphemous to you?

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 10:11 am 
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Disney Duster wrote:
Well in some ways they certainly are bad.

God, are you serious? If that's the case, then you have way, way way way way way way way way way way way way way, way more issues than just being closed minded when it comes to art.

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