Disney Villains Countdown - Discussion

[Deco King]

These are my top three villainesses!! The Wicked Queen/ Witch is my all time favourite, closely followed by Maleficent, then Cruella, stylish ladies all!!

[The Little Merman]

AH (HAPPY SCREAM)!!! ONE OF MY REMARKS ON A VILLAIN IS ON THE COUNTDOWN!!!!!! I had posts for The Evil Queen, Ursula and Maleficent! So far I am on Ursula

[Lucylover1986]

How come there was no update yesterday?

[ichabod]

How come there was no update yesterday?

Probably to save on bandwidth!

[Lucylover1986]

How come there was no update yesterday?

Probably to save on bandwidth!

Ok, just wanted to know. Hopefully everyone will donate enough to get us to our goal. We are at 55% as of this post.

[Luke]

The site went down as we exceeded not only our month's bandwidth, but the maximum 'extra bandwidth' that can be purchased with our current hosting settings. We have upgraded to the new service on previous payments, but in order to cover the next 12 months, we'll still need to reach that goal of $324, which we're 55% of the way to.

[Evil Genie Jafar]

Wasn't too suprised by three of the top 4 villains:

The Evil Queen is one of everyone's favorite.

Even though Scar is a great character by himself, being in one of the most popular Disney movies really helps to remember him and also it helps a LOT to have had such a great and unforgettable scene (Mufasa's "death" ).

What's funny is that I did not think Jafar would make the top 4, much less the second one . The reason? I didn't think Jafar was a memorable character, thanks to Genie If the main character was even overshadowed by him, how would I think another character would be remembered?

With Maleficent is the complete opposite of Jafar's situation. Most people would have forgotten Sleeping Beauty, or don't remember it that well but everyone knows who Maleficent is. And for a good reason: she's just a great character (villain).

PS

To the person that wrote something about the similarities between Jafar and Maleficent, it is true. If you hear Aladdin's audiocomentary (I think when he Jafar hipnotizes the Sultan for the first time) you'll know that the animator (Andreas Deja) really liked and admired Maleficent's character that he thought of her while doing Jafar.

[AwallaceUNC]

I'm very pleased (though not surprised) that Maleficent got the top spot! (Even if I did spell a word incorrectly in my comments ). The countdown was great and I agree with most of the results. I would like to have seen some more live-action foes, but I expect we'll see some of them on the honorable mentions page.

-Aaron

[JayBird]

I have always felt that Lady Tremaine in Cinderella was the most evil of all Disney villans, as her cruelty has no source other than pure sadism. All of the others (from Snow White's Queen to Yzma) had something to gain by their actions and/or felt threatened in some way by the protagonist. But Lady Tremaine not only had all the power, she would have lost none of it had she treated all three girls the same. Yes, Cinderella would have probably outshown her stepsisters with her natural grace, beauty, & talent, but again, this wasn't a threat to the stepmother directly. In fact, it would have reflected well on her (socially) had she climbed on Cinderella's bandwagon (so to speak). But instead, she just hated the girl from day one, had the power to treat her like dirt, and did so. Her "Good night, Cinderella", spoken as the others leave for the ball, is the coldest statement in the Disney oevure (sp?).

The other interesting element about Cinderella is the fate of the antagonists. In the Perrault original (and I realize Disney generally strayed far from sources), the mother & stepsisters are blinded by the king's order as the price for their cruelty. I can understand why Disney didn't go that far; still, in all other films, justice is always served and the bad guys/gals get their just desserts. With Cinderella, the shoe fits (the one not broken, that is) and that's the last we see of the stepfamily. It's just kinda glossed over, while Snow White's queen falls off a cliff, Cruella deVil's car crashes and she is left in the muck, Scar is destroyed by the hyenas, and so on. Don't count sequels: in most all of them, the villains do come back, but they still have received some measure of punishment in the initial films. But somehow, these ladies get off the hook.....

[Just Myself]

I think Scar deserved the top spot. He's got probably the most memorable villain scene in a Disney movie, and what does he get?! Number three.

[lolopimp]

':shock:' ...What???? Jafar number 2?????

Not that Jafar doesn't deserve the spot, trust me he's one of the best Disney Villains ever, but I never thought He would go on so high. I thought both Scar and The Queen would fet 2 and 3 and then Jafar the 4th place (malificent was abvious to be number one, I mean just look at her, She's the devil himself!!)

Anyways, these were my expectations for the countdown......
1_malificent
2-Scar
3- Queen
4- Jafar.

Still, I'm very pleased with the results and to see that my favorite movie's villain is number three.

[Wonderlicious]

The countdown results were as I'd predicted. I knew that Malifecant would get to number one. When the idea was first suggested, I thought she'd be number 1.

For the next countdown, I think we should do heros and heroines. We could do two seperate countdowns, one for the female protaginists, one for the male ones, like the AFI's 100 heroes and villains. Mickey and chums don't count.

[Wonderlicious]

Oh, I forgot something...

Welcome to the forum JayBird

[rnrlesnar]

After reading that Malifecant is the #1 villian, it just came to me that her voice sounds similar to Hilary Clinton. Comparing Hilary to her is actually pretty fitting Anyone else think the voices resemble one another?

[JayBird]

Thanks for the welcome. I'm new to the discussion board biz, but there's few joys in life to top academic discussion, even if the topic is no more consequential than animated characters. I would be interested to hear what you think of what I said about Cinderella's stepmother & stepsisters not receiving any visible punishment for their crimes. I'm open to correction if someone can tell me any other Disney film where this is so.

[Jack]

Chiming in late here, but I have to say it was an awesome countdown - possibly the best we've had yet! We had a lot of great comments, ranging from thought-provoking to side-bustingly-hilarious, but all very good.

Also, I got quite a few suprises when it came to the ranking, notably Frollo and Jafar. I didn't expect either of them to be that high up on the list, but its nice to see them there nontheless.

[Sorcerer Mickey]

Congrats to Maleficent for placing #1!

[2099net]

Well, I've been waiting for the countdown to finish, and here's my commments on selected characters and placements.

30. Commodore Barbossa

Well, I'm sorry that only one live action villain made it into the countdown, and I'm even more sorry its Commodore Barbossa. An average villain from an average film (of course, only in my opinon). Still, he had a monkey. Monkey's are fun!

24. Clayton

I'm not sure how much is Disney, and how much is in the original story, but Jake hits this one right on the head. Clayton is a villain for the 21st Century (even though he's set in the early 20th and made in the late 20th). Clayton doesn't want to take over a kingdom or other such high-flying schemes. He just wants to make a profit, and is content to destroy anything in order to do this. He should have been higher. (See also Randall Bloggs at 27 for similar motivations).

23. Pete

I'm pleased to see that DisneyGirl mirrors my thoughts on Pete exactly (and does so with considerably less padding too!) I'm not sure if Pete is the "Ultimate Disney Villain" or not. But he's the "Ultimate Villain" for Disney's "Ultimate Trio", which is good enough for me.

21. The Horned King

Considering The Black Cauldron is often seen as the runt of the Disney animated features, I think his 21st position shows how people generally only considered the animated characters. I'm surprised he even rated (I see nobody sent any comments, but I assume John Hurts voice work was the main reason).

17. Professor Ratigan

Wow. A total surprise. I was expecting Ratigan to be in the 25-30 range, if at all. Ratigan (and The Great Mouse Detective on the whole) deserve more love. I'm touched.

18. Madam Medusa

I know that there are certain similarities to Cruella De Vil (for good reason, Cruella was to star in The Rescuers for a brief time) but I think Madam Medusa deserves to be higher than (the animated) Cruella. Walt Disney may have been dead when she was created, but she could easily have been "Walt's Favorite Villain!" if he was alive (for a brief moment anyway).

10. Judge Frollo

It's odd, but like Clayton, Frollo comes from period literature, and like Clayton, Frollo appears to be more relevant to the world today than villains created especially for Disney's modern films. Perhaps great literature is great literature for this reason – it never truly dates. Sadly, the world today is full of people intent on repressing others while claiming to be doing good.

8. Hades

Again a shocker. Hercules generally gets overlooked, and I'm glad to see Hades do so well.

6. Cruella De Vil

I prefer the live action version (especially in 102 Dalmatians).

3. Scar

I truly expected Scar to win (him or Jafar). I do think even at number 3 Scar is overrated. He wants to become king/rule. Well, so did (to certain extents) Gov Ratcliffe, Prince John, Shan-Yu, Prof. Rattigan, Yzma, Hades, Ursula and Jafar. And when he does, he rules poorly and as a dictator (see Prince John, and Ursula and Jafar briefly). He really doesn't have much to stand out from the crowd for me, other than his vocal performance. I would placed Scar lower.

2. Jafar

Well, Iago describes Jafar beautifully when he says that Iago was the brains of the pair in Return of Jafar. While he may not be 100% correct, he's more right than wrong. Jafar, ironically seems to have more cunning and menace in Return of Jafar than in Aladdin itself. But I'll admit, in Aladdin the pair of Jafar and Iago work perfectly. But again, not really unique enough to be as highly placed.

1. Maleficent

Well, people always state Maleficent is the ultimate villain, but what does she actually do? Not a lot when you look at it. (But of course, nothing much happens in Sleeping Beauty anyway narrative wise). I'll admit Maleficent's voicing is superb, but doesn't The Queen from Snow White or Lady Tremaine (also voiced by Elanor Audley) deserve more credit for actually being more evil and achieving more evil deeds?

I also have a general comment for Luke. Well done in researching the characters. I'm especially impressed with the fact that the lead animator for each character is listed.

[Luke]

Well, so did (to certain extents) Gov Ratcliffe, Prince John, Shan-Yu, Prof. Rattigan, Yzma, Hades, Ursula and Jafarm.

Yeah, but they didn't hire hyenas to go kill their brother and nephew! L

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, 2099net. I enjoyed reading them!

[wobble-the-witch-cat]

I think that Grimhilde, the Wicked Queen ( according to the official Disney comic anyway!!) is my all time favourite, followed by Maleficent, and then Cruella De Vil.

I love the early Gustav Tenggren images of the Wicked Queen/Witch, they are wonderful Arthur Rackham -like drawings which really should be reproduced more often. I know that the original Snow White poster that Gustav Tenggren designed is still widely available, but I really feel I'd like to see a reproduction of the Gustav Tenggren drawing of the Witch stirring her cauldron of poison with a large bone (It's one of the sequences Disney "culled" from the great movie before it was released, and is featured in the Missing Scenes section on the DVD Boxset!! In fact Disney should reissue the Tenggren book version of Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs, perhaps they'll do this when the movie reaches it's 70th Anniversary in 2007.

I wonder what delights the Disney Studio is planning for the very special 70th Anniversary of Snow White and The Seven Dwarfs? At the very least a new deluxe remastered cinema release print should be produced, ( I for one, would love to see a cinema release for the landmark Disney animation, and in fact I hope that it gets a cinema release before it's 70th Anniverary!! ) and hopefully an even greater digitally remastered DVD release. After all technology is advancing all the time and the leaps forward by then should make improvements from the last Platinium release Box Set!