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PostPosted: Fri Dec 29, 2017 12:13 pm 
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I remember that in a video game he was established as a Disney Villain? Do you think that's true?

I don't. He was never bad towards Dumbo or Mrs. Jumbo. When he did what he did to her was just because of her reaction. But he wasn't cruel cause he wanted.

And now that I opened this post... Do you think Si and Am and Cheshire Cat are villains as well?

Si and Am are officially labeled as so but to me they were just causing problems for the sake of it. Lady and the Tramp does not have a villain.

As for Cheshire I have Disney Villains play cards and a checkers game and he is supposed to be one. He is not by any means. Then, why is this?


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 8:11 am 
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I don't consider him a villain, but it still makes me uncomfortable what he does to Mrs. Jumbo (but, again, he didn't know why she was acting like that). I don't consider Cheshire Cat a villain; they are all mad... But I do consider Si & Am villains. They do know better, in my opinion-- they just don't like dogs, want their mom to think that they're innocent wittle kitties, and they want the house to themselves, and they'll do what it takes to get what they want.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:12 pm 
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No, he is not.

One fault behind Disney characterizations is that there has always been a black-and-white view behind character traits, to the extent where even those whom are morally conflicted are considered villains. In Frank & Ollie's Villains book, they acknowledged Dumbo as being the rare Disney film with no real villains, but for others, they list the Cheshire Cat, Brer Rabbit, and even the Beast as villains.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:24 am 
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DC Fan wrote:
Si and Am are officially labeled as so but to me they were just causing problems for the sake of it. Lady and the Tramp does not have a villain.

Lady and the Tramp does have a villain! Big Red! And yes, also the Siamese cats.

The ringmaster isn't a villain I guess but I only base that off of what I barely remember and what everyone else says. He was the villain in the video game Disney's Villains Revenge I wager you are talking about. That is a freaking awesome game! Off-topic, do you think there should be a sequel game with Maleficent, Ursula, Jafar, and Cruella DeVille? I would sooo love that!

The Queen of Hearts is kind of a villain in Alice but since they're all mad maybe they aren't responsible for their actions and thus none of them are villains.

Wow Frank and Ollie thought Brer Rabbit was a villain?! lol

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:16 am 
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I don't consider the Ringmaster a villain either. I wonder if Disney has listed him as one in other forms of media and merchandise besides the Disney Villains game. I can't remember if he was in the Disney Villains Monopoly game or not. I remember the Cheshire Cat and the Mad Hatter both were there. I was surprised about the Hatter but not the Cheshire Cat since Disney regularly included him in Disney Villain merchandise up until the 2010 Alice film. I can see the reasoning for the Cheshire Cat even if I don't agree with it, especially as a fan of the book. I don't see Br'er Rabbit as a villain at all, but I can see the reasoning behind the Beast and I know that in early 90s merchandise, he was sometimes included in Villain stuff. I do consider Si & Am to be villains though, although the film's true villain is probably the rat.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:47 am 
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The Cheshire Cat, along with a few others are more in the instagator column. They function as trolls in a more modern sense, usually incidential obstacles, and whether they're harmful/helpful depends on the oppossing character and the situation.

The "troll" trait was prevalent among many non-Disney characters thru the 1940s, such as Woody Woodpecker, Tom & Jerry, Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck, etc. Disney even experimented with it with the Aracuan Bird.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:15 pm 
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Thank you for your well thought answers.

My guess for Ringmaster and Si and Am as Villains is that, since Villains are very popular in Disney movies they just have to have them every where.

Si and Am I will have to agree. Mainly because if Funko decides to make a figure of them I'll add to my collection. 8)

But, again, thank you for your answers.


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